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you're listening to IRA the inception

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extraordinary phenomena investigations

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council presents epic voyages

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come join us as we enter and experience

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the great mysteries of the world with

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howdy welcome to epic voyagers I'm Jim

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Marrs your permanent floating temporary

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sometimes stand-in host but tonight boy

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we got a show for you

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we're gonna be talking about one of the

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most amazing UFO incidents in this

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nation's history unfortunately it

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happened a long time ago I'm not gonna

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say what I was doing but I was only

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about nine years old at the time

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and I will be realized with you I did

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not take much notice at that time but

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today I think it is a very very

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important case but before we get into

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this which of course this case I'm

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talking about how the course is UFOs

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over Washington DC now it stands to

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reason if people from somewhere else are

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visiting the earth they would want to go

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to these centres of leadership so you

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know I've even had people ask me in

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recent years well you know why don't

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they go to Washington well they did and

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tonight we're gonna discuss what

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happened how and why and I'm gonna have

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some special guest on number one is a

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former intelligence officer who is now

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retired and he's going to tell us what

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he knows in his experience in the

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Washington area in 1952 and then next

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we're going to have one of epochs own

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officers who also was a witness at the

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time so stay tuned this is going to be a

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good one but first let's go back and

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talk about the background of this story

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the reality of UFOs at least to the

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population of Washington DC became

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pretty undeniable on the evening of July

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the 19th 1952 when more than eight

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objects were tracked on radar at both

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Andrews Air Force Base and Washington

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National Airport they were cruising

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along at speeds of a hundred to 130

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miles an hour but would then accelerate

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to fantastically high speeds these

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objects were observed by experienced

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pilots air traffic controllers tracked

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by radar and seen by thousands of people

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for several hours and the thing to keep

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in mind is these objects whatever they

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were were well within Washington's most

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restricted airspace they passed over

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over the next several days they kept

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coming back and this of course was

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simply the latest in a whole spate of

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UFO sightings actually around the world

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of course as we all know that really got

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kick-started in June of 1947

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when some UFOs were spotted over Mount

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Rainier but when the sightings over

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Washington first began the news media

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was right on topic news reporters and

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photographers pressed into the radar

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room at National Airport and we're

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watching these objects zooming all

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around however before too long the media

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was ordered out the explanation was that

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oh well they might learn classified

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radio frequencies and procedures that

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could be used that were being used to

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vector the fighters against the UFOs

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captain Everage a rupal t' who was

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involved in this and later would become

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the head of one of the first official

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UFO investigations project grudge said

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quote I knew this explanation was absurd

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because any ham radio operator worth its

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salt salt could build equipment and

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listen in on any intercept he later said

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that the real reason for dismissing the

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media was to prevent them from learning

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the reality of the UFOs should one be

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brought down f94 military jets were sent

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aloft to intercept these bogeys which

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were flying through this restricted

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airspace but every time the Jets would

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close in the UFOs would accelerate who

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be out of sight raid our positions were

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given but the ground observers couldn't

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seem to see anything it was all very

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frustrating

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the news media went wild headlines said

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fiery objects outrun jets over the

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Capitol investigation veiled in secrecy

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following vain chase and jets alerted

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for saucers interceptors chase lights

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into DC skies that was back when

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newspapers still had some control and

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were not under the total dominance of

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their corporate masters so the next day

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our after several days on July the 29th

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Major General John Samford called a news

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conference trying to respond to this

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hoorah

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it was the largest and longest press

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conference convened by the Air Force

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since World War two according to rupal

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general Samford hedged on some questions

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simply because it didn't have an answer

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and he finally passed the buck to

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intelligence officer who speculated that

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all of the stuff over Washington was

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actually caused by temperature

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inversions now this is a phenomenon that

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creates pockets of warm air unable to

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rise due to similar temperature layers

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in the sky and temperature inversions

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that sometimes can reflect light and

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might even be picked up on radar so of

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course the news media duly reported that

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Air Force debunk saucers as just natural

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phenomenon however the civilian

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Aeronautics Authority and the CIA which

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is a forerunner of our current fed

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Aviation Administration the FAA

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conducted a study and they too concluded

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that temperature inversion had been

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indicated in almost every instance of

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the Washington sightings but this was of

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course warmly embraced by all the

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debunkers especially since so many of

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them had been spotted 50 targets alone

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were tracked on May the 23rd which even

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proceeded in July but however it has

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since been determined that during those

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nights in June July and August the radar

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images had only appeared on a few nights

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and that the temperature was not such as

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to create temperature inversions

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so eventually of course not made clear

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to the public the Washington National

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it's really amazing what has happened

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since then because of course we've had

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all of the policies changing for example

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this will blow you away this I think may

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be evidence of an actual shooting war

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between UFOs and the military 42 New

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York Times between 1951 1956 192

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aircraft either vanished or were crashed

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and destroyed in June in July 1952 the

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period we're talking about 94 fighter

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jets worldwide either disappeared or

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crashed and 51 men were confirmed killed

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now of course since they vanished and

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since they crashed then you can't always

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say they were shot down by you

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photos but what would provoke something

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like that well the news meter reported

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in 1952 quote the airforce today

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revealed that jet pilots had been placed

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on 24-hour nationwide alert against

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flying saucers with orders to shoot them

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down if they refused to land by July the

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30th

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Major General Roger Ramey deputy chief

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of therefore staff of operations that

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name may sound familiar to you he was

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the one who met with reporters and

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Carswell Air Force Base in Fort Worth

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Texas

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a few days after whatever crashed in

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Roswell and tried to explain it away as

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a weather balloon even though he was

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holding a telegram in his hand that

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modern computer enhancement is shown to

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contain words like crash victims etc but

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he also at that time in 1952 tried to

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explain that yes he admitted that

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interceptor planes had been sent aloft

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several hundred times as the report

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result of reported sightings of UFOs but

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he stressed as this was just standard

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procedure and then of course between

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1951 and 1952 we had all these crashes

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and planes vanishing then of course the

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military apparently got cooler heads and

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said okay nevermind and they ordered doe

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not shoot them down the instructions

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became were changed and they became

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known as the communication instructions

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for reporting vital intelligence

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sightings or service and the orders

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directed pilots to report UFOs but keep

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the reports secret under penalties

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contained in the Communications Act of

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1934 and espionage laws so and before

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too long this censorship and secrecy

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extended well beyond the military you

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see prior to about this time about

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nineteen

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52 53 54 airline pilots were routinely

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reporting sightings of UFOs but the

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procedure at that time was for them to

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come back land and report to their

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prospective company's respective

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companies which of course really didn't

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have any means of doing much about it

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but at least the reports were there for

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the public to see but on February 17

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1954 the air force officials met with

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representatives of the major airlines

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and at that time Scripps Howard new

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service was reporting that commercial

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pilots had been sighting between five

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and ten UFO sightings per night prior to

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this meeting and the Air Force said well

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they wanted to get the reports in the

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quickest way so that they they began to

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take the government military orders

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known as joint Army Navy Air Force

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publication 146 or janap and they

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applied the Gienapp rules then to the

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commercial airlines they commercial the

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commercial pilots now were not to report

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directly to their employers but instead

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to send reports to the military air

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transport service or Matt's intelligence

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in Washington or to the nearest Air

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Force Base and they were also asked not

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to discuss their sightings publicly or

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give them to the newspapers this

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prompted one pilot to say this Air Force

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policy in is a lesson in lying and Creed

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the big brother attitude carried to the

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ultimate extreme despite the fact that

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nearly 500 airline pilots signed a

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petition protesting the Gienapp policy

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it was still carried through someone

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with a great deal of power was

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determined to close off public

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discussions of UFOs so back

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Washington what really happened was it

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just temperature aversion well I'm

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hoping that we have Colonel Paul on the

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line Colonel Paul has asked that we not

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give out his last name because he still

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has concerns

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he worked intelligence for years and of

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course you'd learn very quickly you're

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not supposed to talk but at this point

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he's now 84 years old and has determined

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that he thinks the public has a right to

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know about UFOs and the existence of

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extraterrestrial life this is Jim Marrs

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talking to you colonel Paul and I've

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been asked we're not gonna mention your

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last name but can you briefly tell us

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your background in the US military I I

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was in military I was in intelligence in

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Washington as a civilian after I

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graduated from the University of

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Maryland and I was in for about nine

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years and then I went to another job in

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the same building that I was in then and

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was communications specialist I see and

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I understand that in July of 1952

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you were in Stover Springs Maryland is

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that correct that's correct

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well what happened to you in Silver

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Springs then Paul well out I noticed a 1

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outside of my residence and not my

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parents residence and noticed that there

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were 9 shining objects in a v-formation

279
00:17:24,590 --> 00:17:20,130
going due north over the middle of the

280
00:17:27,700 --> 00:17:24,600
DC area into Maryland and estimated that

281
00:17:31,670 --> 00:17:27,710
they were about twenty miles high

282
00:17:37,580 --> 00:17:31,680
that was higher than any airplane we had

283
00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:37,590
at that time mm-hmm they continued for

284
00:17:48,940 --> 00:17:40,890
about 15 minutes until they were out of

285
00:17:53,540 --> 00:17:48,950
sight and they disappeared as a point of

286
00:17:57,260 --> 00:17:53,550
one point of light of course that was at

287
00:18:03,799 --> 00:17:57,270
a very large distance did they had

288
00:18:08,540 --> 00:18:03,809
traveled to to to the point that I

289
00:18:10,850 --> 00:18:08,550
couldn't find him anymore did they did

290
00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:10,860
they stay in formation or did one or

291
00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:13,530
more they they stayed in formation

292
00:18:21,070 --> 00:18:16,410
except for there was a v-shaped

293
00:18:29,270 --> 00:18:21,080
formation pointing towards the north and

294
00:18:30,890 --> 00:18:29,280
they were and North had been right

295
00:18:33,530 --> 00:18:30,900
towards Washington right

296
00:18:36,020 --> 00:18:33,540
no towards the other way they had

297
00:18:38,120 --> 00:18:36,030
finished going over bogging they had

298
00:18:43,090 --> 00:18:38,130
been to Washington and then passing over

299
00:18:51,830 --> 00:18:43,100
your position okay that's right and then

300
00:19:00,310 --> 00:18:51,840
let's see then I noticed that they were

301
00:19:06,020 --> 00:19:00,320
under a tremendous a tremendous size

302
00:19:11,530 --> 00:19:06,030
invisible dish which was about a

303
00:19:19,130 --> 00:19:11,540
thousand feet in diameter the words and

304
00:19:26,090 --> 00:19:19,140
I have a sketch here that I'm looking at

305
00:19:29,060 --> 00:19:26,100
right now mm-hmm to you this disc did

306
00:19:29,750 --> 00:19:29,070
not appear to be a solid object no it

307
00:19:34,130 --> 00:19:29,760
did not

308
00:19:36,770 --> 00:19:34,140
you could see right through it but I

309
00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:36,780
think I figured that they they were

310
00:19:43,470 --> 00:19:39,010
protecting those though

311
00:19:46,020 --> 00:19:43,480
that one big disc was year belonged the

312
00:19:47,100 --> 00:19:46,030
other discs belong to it or they were

313
00:19:50,670 --> 00:19:47,110
protecting it

314
00:19:53,310 --> 00:19:50,680
I don't suppose in 1952 that too many

315
00:19:56,540 --> 00:19:53,320
people were thinking in terms of energy

316
00:19:58,890 --> 00:19:56,550
force-field but would would that be a

317
00:20:01,800 --> 00:19:58,900
accurate description of what you think

318
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:01,810
that might have been yes I've concluded

319
00:20:11,850 --> 00:20:07,450
the same same thing huh how long did

320
00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:11,860
these objects remain in sight for about

321
00:20:21,120 --> 00:20:16,330
10 minutes so they were moving

322
00:20:26,370 --> 00:20:21,130
relatively slowly that's right but at

323
00:20:33,110 --> 00:20:26,380
that you ever see at that height that is

324
00:20:35,820 --> 00:20:33,120
not real slow huh no nothing it was

325
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:35,830
could you offer a nest could you offer

326
00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:38,410
an estimation and what speeds they were

327
00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:46,930
traveling well no I hadn't figured that

328
00:20:54,060 --> 00:20:50,530
out okay ten minutes they were over at

329
00:20:57,900 --> 00:20:54,070
least New York or New Jersey well that's

330
00:21:02,030 --> 00:20:57,910
really moving on did you at any time did

331
00:21:05,940 --> 00:21:02,040
you see any of our of jet interceptors

332
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:05,950
have I seen a jet interception did you

333
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:08,890
see at that time any of our interceptors

334
00:21:18,540 --> 00:21:15,850
I know not okay did you try to contact

335
00:21:22,790 --> 00:21:18,550
and tell anyone in authority about what

336
00:21:27,300 --> 00:21:22,800
you'd seen I called the Air Force in the

337
00:21:32,100 --> 00:21:27,310
Pentagon and they just scored your

338
00:21:36,660 --> 00:21:32,110
shoulders and laughed me off and didn't

339
00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:36,670
tell them my background or anything so

340
00:21:43,170 --> 00:21:38,890
they just just thought you were just a

341
00:21:44,910 --> 00:21:43,180
civilian calling in mm-hmm and I guess

342
00:21:47,130 --> 00:21:44,920
they treated you like they did anyone

343
00:21:50,550 --> 00:21:47,140
else they just blew you off right got

344
00:21:51,360 --> 00:21:50,560
the thing same old same old same old

345
00:21:53,070 --> 00:21:51,370
same old

346
00:21:55,769 --> 00:21:53,080
well I understand there was some

347
00:21:57,749 --> 00:21:55,779
you talk to a news reporter on the by

348
00:22:08,690 --> 00:21:57,759
telephone and there may have been even

349
00:22:24,029 --> 00:22:18,989
probably a 19-6 5064 was that the other

350
00:22:25,739 --> 00:22:24,039
incident or sixty four or five yeah okay

351
00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:25,749
so you had another experience well let's

352
00:22:33,450 --> 00:22:30,369
move up then to 1964 which of course was

353
00:22:38,609 --> 00:22:33,460
the year that Lyndon Johnson was

354
00:22:41,389 --> 00:22:38,619
president and one that was the one that

355
00:22:45,389 --> 00:22:41,399
raised a lot of a lot of stink

356
00:22:54,330 --> 00:22:45,399
all right well tell us about that well

357
00:22:57,899 --> 00:22:54,340
we were I was in my office and at 4:20

358
00:23:06,599 --> 00:22:57,909
we have to close the windows and lock

359
00:23:11,669 --> 00:23:06,609
them for security and I was on the east

360
00:23:18,409 --> 00:23:11,679
side of the wing and of that building

361
00:23:25,310 --> 00:23:18,419
and I noticed about 12 to 15 objects

362
00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:29,249
direction and they were being pursued by

363
00:23:36,299 --> 00:23:34,690
two Jets so that's where the gender

364
00:23:42,269 --> 00:23:36,309
interceptors came in and was this

365
00:23:45,289 --> 00:23:42,279
sighting he had in 1964 right okay so

366
00:23:48,859 --> 00:23:45,299
what life so what happened when the Jets

367
00:23:57,389 --> 00:23:48,869
did they ever catch up with the objects

368
00:24:00,619 --> 00:23:57,399
well they did but after about after much

369
00:24:05,909 --> 00:24:00,629
huffing and puffing believe me and

370
00:24:07,070 --> 00:24:05,919
bellowing but you know was yet there's

371
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:07,080
got all the

372
00:24:17,370 --> 00:24:11,850
all the [\h__\h] open in this right in the

373
00:24:21,810 --> 00:24:17,380
fuel and it it just is a black streak

374
00:24:23,850 --> 00:24:21,820
you know those are all jets so they were

375
00:24:26,250 --> 00:24:23,860
they were pouring on the coal they were

376
00:24:28,530 --> 00:24:26,260
giving it everything they had everything

377
00:24:37,470 --> 00:24:28,540
they had and they finally caught up to

378
00:24:45,620 --> 00:24:37,480
them and what happened was astounding to

379
00:24:50,340 --> 00:24:45,630
me as soon as they reached a point where

380
00:24:52,820 --> 00:24:50,350
where the other the other people didn't

381
00:24:57,150 --> 00:24:52,830
want to be bothered with them any longer

382
00:24:59,430 --> 00:24:57,160
they took off any in the UFO yeah

383
00:25:07,130 --> 00:24:59,440
meaning meaning the people in the UFOs

384
00:25:09,990 --> 00:25:07,140
or whatever yeah the at that point

385
00:25:14,580 --> 00:25:10,000
somebody pushed the button and they went

386
00:25:19,490 --> 00:25:14,590
so fast it looked like the Jets had

387
00:25:26,750 --> 00:25:19,500
stopped at have you ever seen that no

388
00:25:29,940 --> 00:25:26,760
not a tear in midair that's at the speed

389
00:25:35,850 --> 00:25:29,950
this is what astounded be at a speed

390
00:25:38,790 --> 00:25:35,860
that was incomprehensible just about for

391
00:25:42,500 --> 00:25:38,800
me to be watching and then all of a

392
00:25:46,140 --> 00:25:42,510
sudden that stopped my goodness I

393
00:25:48,540 --> 00:25:46,150
couldn't believe it so they they took

394
00:25:50,130 --> 00:25:48,550
off at such a speed it made the jet

395
00:25:52,190 --> 00:25:50,140
fighters that were going full-bore

396
00:25:55,380 --> 00:25:52,200
looked like they were just sitting still

397
00:26:00,720 --> 00:25:55,390
that's right that was the impression I

398
00:26:04,260 --> 00:26:00,730
got in round two to my eye that's right

399
00:26:07,890 --> 00:26:04,270
and that's all I can report did you try

400
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:07,900
to report that incident oh yes several

401
00:26:19,369 --> 00:26:16,570
times I went down I was in I was invited

402
00:26:32,669 --> 00:26:30,060
to the TV station and I got down I cut

403
00:26:38,099 --> 00:26:32,679
down they're not the same day but

404
00:26:42,930 --> 00:26:38,109
several days later and they absolutely

405
00:26:48,299 --> 00:26:42,940
did not want me to mention any other

406
00:26:49,709 --> 00:26:48,309
aircraft in the sky and their worship

407
00:26:54,559 --> 00:26:49,719
yeah they didn't want you to talk about

408
00:27:01,889 --> 00:26:54,569
the jet fighters right that's right

409
00:27:03,169 --> 00:27:01,899
they're stopping close to my eye that's

410
00:27:08,249 --> 00:27:03,179
exactly right

411
00:27:11,669 --> 00:27:08,259
Wow is this when you were talking to a

412
00:27:15,659 --> 00:27:11,679
news reporter and some times were called

413
00:27:20,699 --> 00:27:15,669
up I had called up to the office they

414
00:27:25,709 --> 00:27:20,709
divided me down there and was created I

415
00:27:30,319 --> 00:27:25,719
don't know who was now but by a male and

416
00:27:38,669 --> 00:27:30,329
he informed me that I will only be

417
00:27:45,589 --> 00:27:38,679
invited to talk about about the UFOs if

418
00:27:50,579 --> 00:27:45,599
I did not mention anything about jets or

419
00:27:52,769 --> 00:27:50,589
u.s. airport air air Jets now this was

420
00:27:56,819 --> 00:27:52,779
coming from a media producer right not

421
00:28:00,779 --> 00:27:56,829
from the military no that was that was a

422
00:28:06,599 --> 00:28:00,789
meteor for the producer and I said are

423
00:28:09,930 --> 00:28:06,609
you sure and I said I'm going home if if

424
00:28:15,059 --> 00:28:09,940
you don't want me to tell what the whole

425
00:28:20,489 --> 00:28:15,069
story is and he called the other guy on

426
00:28:23,969 --> 00:28:20,499
the phone whoever it is he told me the

427
00:28:28,589 --> 00:28:23,979
other guy had did not speak to he did

428
00:28:33,249 --> 00:28:28,599
and he said he won't get in he doesn't

429
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:37,549
so that I left I felt like I was had

430
00:28:50,090 --> 00:28:45,090
been put upon and asked was being asked

431
00:28:54,889 --> 00:28:50,100
to put the public on about the whole

432
00:28:58,039 --> 00:28:54,899
thing and I was ended well good for you

433
00:29:01,460 --> 00:28:58,049
we need more plain straight talking

434
00:29:03,830 --> 00:29:01,470
people like you well listen in both

435
00:29:06,049 --> 00:29:03,840
these instances and particularly the one

436
00:29:09,739 --> 00:29:06,059
in 1952 when you saw the formation

437
00:29:11,539 --> 00:29:09,749
coming out of the Washington DC area it

438
00:29:13,460 --> 00:29:11,549
was there any reason to offer you to

439
00:29:18,799 --> 00:29:13,470
even consider that this might be some

440
00:29:21,109 --> 00:29:18,809
kind of a natural weather phenomena well

441
00:29:27,799 --> 00:29:21,119
I had never seen anything like that and

442
00:29:33,729 --> 00:29:27,809
in my business I was studying those

443
00:29:44,419 --> 00:29:33,739
things all the time oh you were studying

444
00:29:48,349 --> 00:29:44,429
UFOs there were reports in and out you

445
00:29:51,769 --> 00:29:48,359
know what I mean in crime before they

446
00:29:58,789 --> 00:29:51,779
that's before they cleaned up everything

447
00:30:00,619 --> 00:29:58,799
so what did you have any orders from

448
00:30:07,220 --> 00:30:00,629
your superiors how to handle such

449
00:30:08,779 --> 00:30:07,230
reports I did not in fact he didn't even

450
00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:08,789
know anything about it

451
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:23,010
my superior did I'm sure do nothing

452
00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:30,250
about UFOs at that time neither try hmm

453
00:30:35,670 --> 00:30:33,610
well in light of today and after your

454
00:30:37,770 --> 00:30:35,680
years of experience what are your

455
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:37,780
thoughts today do you if you have any

456
00:30:44,430 --> 00:30:39,370
what is your idea what do you think

457
00:30:47,510 --> 00:30:44,440
these things work well I have since kind

458
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:47,520
of the conclusion that they are

459
00:30:53,420 --> 00:30:51,610
extraterrestrial it there in our skies

460
00:30:57,420 --> 00:30:53,430
all the time

461
00:31:04,680 --> 00:30:57,430
at will they are not from one area

462
00:31:08,550 --> 00:31:04,690
they're from many areas and it appears

463
00:31:14,190 --> 00:31:08,560
as though they're or you know Eisenhower

464
00:31:19,790 --> 00:31:14,200
had two visits and flew out to make

465
00:31:25,550 --> 00:31:19,800
contact with it's on it's on record

466
00:31:36,570 --> 00:31:25,560
anybody can look it up and the first

467
00:31:43,170 --> 00:31:36,580
group that he met offers him a cure for

468
00:31:46,650 --> 00:31:43,180
all as I would say it a cure for

469
00:31:51,810 --> 00:31:46,660
diseases whoa

470
00:31:58,970 --> 00:31:51,820
and the second group not at the same

471
00:32:10,250 --> 00:32:05,240
offering him military benefits and and

472
00:32:13,770 --> 00:32:10,260
you know except these were the greys I

473
00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:13,780
never have found out really who the

474
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:18,490
other group was now did you learn this

475
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:20,650
through study or did you hear this from

476
00:32:25,790 --> 00:32:24,250
people within have I'll read books about

477
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:25,800
it

478
00:32:35,270 --> 00:32:30,450
see but in 1952 you actually saw them

479
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:35,280
with your own eyes yes okay and of

480
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:37,290
course the official explanation at that

481
00:32:41,470 --> 00:32:39,330
time was that it was just temperature

482
00:32:44,150 --> 00:32:41,480
inversion different aversions of

483
00:32:47,810 --> 00:32:44,160
temperatures causing lights to reflect

484
00:32:48,230 --> 00:32:47,820
down that does not jibe with what you

485
00:32:53,810 --> 00:32:48,240
saw

486
00:33:01,070 --> 00:32:53,820
visit absolutely not I am blessed where

487
00:33:05,890 --> 00:33:01,080
I was blessed with 2010 vision and know

488
00:33:08,870 --> 00:33:05,900
what I see exactly you know what you see

489
00:33:11,090 --> 00:33:08,880
all right Colonel Paul thank you so much

490
00:33:13,910 --> 00:33:11,100
for joining me tonight and thank you for

491
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:13,920
sharing your story with our audience I'm

492
00:33:18,370 --> 00:33:16,290
sure they find that very very

493
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:18,380
interesting and very very relieved

494
00:33:23,810 --> 00:33:20,970
revealing and of course it fits in

495
00:33:26,180 --> 00:33:23,820
perfectly with many other accounts from

496
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:26,190
that period of time is there anything

497
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:28,730
you'd like to add before we go to a

498
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:35,570
break here I would like to see the US

499
00:33:45,670 --> 00:33:40,650
come clean and say hey we tried to

500
00:33:51,290 --> 00:33:45,680
handle this but there is no answer to it

501
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:51,300
here's what it is right do you in your

502
00:34:00,830 --> 00:33:53,250
mind is there any reason to believe that

503
00:34:10,399 --> 00:34:00,840
these ETS are hostile I've never I've

504
00:34:16,149 --> 00:34:10,409
never had I have other I have other not

505
00:34:19,130 --> 00:34:16,159
contact but indications of non hostility

506
00:34:22,100 --> 00:34:19,140
v okay

507
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:22,110
all right so in other words we just get

508
00:34:26,899 --> 00:34:23,970
a visit from the neighbors and our first

509
00:34:28,820 --> 00:34:26,909
response was to order military jets to

510
00:34:31,820 --> 00:34:28,830
shoot them down there they later

511
00:34:33,649 --> 00:34:31,830
rescinded that of course but I guess

512
00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:33,659
that kind of paints a picture of where

513
00:34:38,540 --> 00:34:36,450
we are we're not very good not very good

514
00:34:43,430 --> 00:34:38,550
neighbors are we not very good

515
00:34:46,970 --> 00:34:43,440
no come clean start all over there we go

516
00:34:51,410 --> 00:34:46,980
I'm with you thank you Paul thank you

517
00:36:11,330 --> 00:34:51,420
thank him thank you very much okay that

518
00:36:14,750 --> 00:36:11,340
was an 8455 8455 8455 Irian swell flying

519
00:36:17,420 --> 00:36:14,760
to hawaii-- he said that to dish shape

520
00:36:20,660 --> 00:36:17,430
crafts flying at speeds estimated more

521
00:36:22,700 --> 00:36:20,670
than 1500 miles an hour which believing

522
00:36:26,180 --> 00:36:22,710
folks was impossible for jets of that

523
00:36:28,970 --> 00:36:26,190
era zoomed and circled his executive

524
00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:28,980
plane another plane carrying Admiral

525
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:33,090
Arthur Redford upon landing Kimball

526
00:36:38,270 --> 00:36:35,370
radioed the Air Force with a report of

527
00:36:40,700 --> 00:36:38,280
what he had seen and sometime later he

528
00:36:43,010 --> 00:36:40,710
was outraged learned that not only at

529
00:36:46,100 --> 00:36:43,020
the Air Force apparently not seriously

530
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:46,110
in this case but we're not even released

531
00:36:53,319 --> 00:36:50,130
to him what analysis they did prepare in

532
00:36:58,069 --> 00:36:53,329
this Secretary of the Navy

533
00:37:02,270 --> 00:36:58,079
and so he ordered the Navy to begin its

534
00:37:05,870 --> 00:37:02,280
own investigation and the part of that

535
00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:05,880
resulted in a very famous incident also

536
00:37:16,940 --> 00:37:11,490
in 1952 when a chief warrant officer

537
00:37:20,240 --> 00:37:16,950
named Delbert Newhouse was in Utah

538
00:37:23,390 --> 00:37:20,250
just north of Salt Lake City and they

539
00:37:26,180 --> 00:37:23,400
saw a group of 12 to 14 bright shiny

540
00:37:29,329 --> 00:37:26,190
objects maneuvering in formation at high

541
00:37:30,829 --> 00:37:29,339
speed and he being a navy photographer

542
00:37:34,220 --> 00:37:30,839
for 21 years

543
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:34,230
Graham described his film camera a set

544
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:36,810
the turret at the 3 inch telephoto lens

545
00:37:44,660 --> 00:37:40,650
and exposed about 40 feet of film before

546
00:37:46,910 --> 00:37:44,670
these objects flew out of sight this

547
00:37:48,819 --> 00:37:46,920
time the film went not to the Air Force

548
00:37:53,990 --> 00:37:48,829
but to the Navy and photo interpretation

549
00:37:56,660 --> 00:37:54,000
laboratory near Washington and they the

550
00:38:00,109 --> 00:37:56,670
analysts there quickly ruled out

551
00:38:03,470 --> 00:38:00,119
aircraft balloons birds and their final

552
00:38:07,790 --> 00:38:03,480
conclusion was unknown objects under

553
00:38:10,970 --> 00:38:07,800
intelligent control one of the best and

554
00:38:13,790 --> 00:38:10,980
most well-documented of the early UFO

555
00:38:17,059 --> 00:38:13,800
accounts well we're coming up to the

556
00:38:18,589 --> 00:38:17,069
midpoint here and I think it's about

557
00:38:22,520 --> 00:38:18,599
time that we take a break

558
00:38:25,880 --> 00:38:22,530
and we'll consider Paul's story and then

559
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:25,890
coming back with any luck we're going to

560
00:38:34,099 --> 00:38:29,810
hear from another eyewitness of the 1952

561
00:38:37,599 --> 00:38:34,109
UFOs over Washington and I'm warning

562
00:38:40,250 --> 00:38:37,609
everyone we've got here in Texas some

563
00:38:43,220 --> 00:38:40,260
thunderstorm activity coming in with

564
00:38:47,089 --> 00:38:43,230
lightning and thunder and so if for some

565
00:38:49,490 --> 00:38:47,099
reason I'm gone away I have not been

566
00:38:51,620 --> 00:38:49,500
abducted problem probably I have

567
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:51,630
probably been the victim of electrical

568
00:38:56,270 --> 00:38:53,970
outage due to thunderstorms but let's

569
00:38:57,349 --> 00:38:56,280
keep our fingers crossed and hopefully

570
00:39:01,520 --> 00:38:57,359
that's not going to happen

571
00:39:02,839 --> 00:39:01,530
and I want all of you to if you have

572
00:39:05,270 --> 00:39:02,849
people interested in UFOs

573
00:39:05,930 --> 00:39:05,280
why don't you here's an opportunity

574
00:39:09,020 --> 00:39:05,940
while

575
00:39:13,819 --> 00:39:09,030
we take a break to call them send an

576
00:39:16,339 --> 00:39:13,829
email Twitter I'm whatever and let them

577
00:39:17,809 --> 00:39:16,349
know that we've got some very

578
00:39:19,970 --> 00:39:17,819
outstanding material that we're

579
00:39:24,550 --> 00:39:19,980
presenting tonight on some of these

580
00:39:29,630 --> 00:39:24,560
early UFO incidents in US history and

581
00:39:36,609 --> 00:39:29,640
encourage them to come listen in so we

582
00:39:43,599 --> 00:39:39,800
hi everybody this is Bill and Nancy and

583
00:39:48,050 --> 00:39:43,609
we are on future theater radio live

584
00:39:50,690 --> 00:39:48,060
Saturday on the inception radio network

585
00:39:53,300 --> 00:39:50,700
epic is extraordinary phenomenon

586
00:39:55,790 --> 00:39:53,310
investigations Council the forum for

587
00:39:57,859 --> 00:39:55,800
scholars experts and those fascinated by

588
00:40:01,190 --> 00:39:57,869
and involved in the study of ancient

589
00:40:04,670 --> 00:40:01,200
civilizations conspiracies cryptozoology

590
00:40:07,099 --> 00:40:04,680
ETS and UFOs French science the

591
00:40:08,599 --> 00:40:07,109
paranormal shamanism and all manner of

592
00:40:11,240 --> 00:40:08,609
extraordinary phenomena

593
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:11,250
please join epic as we examine the

594
00:40:16,490 --> 00:40:13,050
mysteries of the world and beyond on

595
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:16,500
epic voyagers dot-com and for updates on

596
00:40:20,780 --> 00:40:18,690
upcoming interactive video presentations

597
00:40:22,630 --> 00:40:20,790
the latest news and discussion on the

598
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:22,640
epic forum as well as research

599
00:40:27,020 --> 00:40:24,450
investigations and membership

600
00:40:29,599 --> 00:40:27,030
opportunities plus the epic voyagers

601
00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:29,609
program schedule all on the inception

602
00:40:59,290 --> 00:40:57,460
in video hello I'm at us for inviting

603
00:41:01,420 --> 00:40:59,300
you some students and every voyage is

604
00:41:04,030 --> 00:41:01,430
every Monday evening at 8 p.m. Central

605
00:41:06,790 --> 00:41:04,040
Time p.m. Eastern right here on

606
00:41:08,890 --> 00:41:06,800
inception radio network to find out more

607
00:41:14,890 --> 00:41:08,900
about epic how you can become a member

608
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:14,900
visit epic voyagers calm howdy

609
00:41:20,650 --> 00:41:17,810
here we are on epic voyages again epic

610
00:41:23,590 --> 00:41:20,660
voyagers were all voyagers in this epic

611
00:41:25,300 --> 00:41:23,600
adventure and for those of you who may

612
00:41:27,820 --> 00:41:25,310
not be that familiar with epic that

613
00:41:31,060 --> 00:41:27,830
stands for the extraordinary phenomena

614
00:41:34,470 --> 00:41:31,070
investigations Council whoa I guess that

615
00:41:38,530 --> 00:41:34,480
makes us all council members now

616
00:41:42,370 --> 00:41:38,540
well last segment we talked with the 84

617
00:41:44,350 --> 00:41:42,380
year old intelligence analyst Paul and I

618
00:41:47,620 --> 00:41:44,360
apologize I think I started off calling

619
00:41:50,050 --> 00:41:47,630
you Colonel Paul and you'll find out why

620
00:41:54,220 --> 00:41:50,060
I'm not mixed up on this section because

621
00:41:59,470 --> 00:41:54,230
now we're gonna go to Vivian Walker who

622
00:42:03,190 --> 00:41:59,480
is a newly named State Director for epic

623
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:03,200
for the state of Louisiana and a senior

624
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:06,530
investigator and Vivian thank you so

625
00:42:13,780 --> 00:42:08,650
much for being with us tonight

626
00:42:16,390 --> 00:42:13,790
my pleasure I know you've had some

627
00:42:19,630 --> 00:42:16,400
experience in this field before because

628
00:42:22,510 --> 00:42:19,640
you previously worked for another UFO

629
00:42:26,170 --> 00:42:22,520
investigation unit organization crack

630
00:42:28,870 --> 00:42:26,180
yeah I was just a director to them okay

631
00:42:33,010 --> 00:42:28,880
so you're not just jumping into this as

632
00:42:38,080 --> 00:42:33,020
a as a babe in the woods as they say you

633
00:42:43,180 --> 00:42:38,090
know well obviously if you were a

634
00:42:45,490 --> 00:42:43,190
witness to the 1952 events over

635
00:42:49,090 --> 00:42:45,500
Washington DC let's just go all the way

636
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:49,100
back to there and according to my notes

637
00:42:52,060 --> 00:42:49,490
here

638
00:42:54,270 --> 00:42:52,070
you were living on 63rd Avenue which is

639
00:42:58,630 --> 00:42:54,280
a street running north and south and

640
00:43:02,830 --> 00:42:58,640
chief early Maryland Cheverly Chevrolet

641
00:43:07,050 --> 00:43:02,840
as in Chevrolet severally yeah and that

642
00:43:09,609 --> 00:43:07,060
seven miles north east of DC right yeah

643
00:43:12,850 --> 00:43:09,619
okay well let's just start from there

644
00:43:16,090 --> 00:43:12,860
you're a young girl but you were not a

645
00:43:17,320 --> 00:43:16,100
babe in arms either you certainly knew

646
00:43:19,990 --> 00:43:17,330
what was going on in the environment

647
00:43:23,109 --> 00:43:20,000
around you so let's go to that evening

648
00:43:24,670 --> 00:43:23,119
on July the 26th and according to all

649
00:43:28,720 --> 00:43:24,680
the reports and you got it right you

650
00:43:30,790 --> 00:43:28,730
said you believed it was about six or

651
00:43:34,090 --> 00:43:30,800
seven o'clock and I think 6 p.m. is

652
00:43:36,070 --> 00:43:34,100
pretty much what they've nailed tell us

653
00:43:39,250 --> 00:43:36,080
I knew it was around that time only

654
00:43:41,380 --> 00:43:39,260
because I had to put it in into the same

655
00:43:43,450 --> 00:43:41,390
time frame was with when we went to bed

656
00:43:46,150 --> 00:43:43,460
and we were always sent to bed rather

657
00:43:48,190 --> 00:43:46,160
early because you know in the summer I

658
00:43:50,500 --> 00:43:48,200
remember looking out the window and the

659
00:43:53,590 --> 00:43:50,510
kids would be playing out we're already

660
00:43:54,730 --> 00:43:53,600
in our beds so I knew I want you know

661
00:43:56,620 --> 00:43:54,740
early in the evening

662
00:44:00,040 --> 00:43:56,630
yeah sounded like you had some strict

663
00:44:01,540 --> 00:44:00,050
parents like I did yeah and and keep in

664
00:44:05,200 --> 00:44:01,550
mind folks at this time there really

665
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:05,210
wasn't any television and so really we

666
00:44:13,420 --> 00:44:06,890
start getting sundown is about time to

667
00:44:18,430 --> 00:44:13,430
go to bed so you were ahead of us here

668
00:44:21,220 --> 00:44:18,440
in Texas yeah okay so it was a bad

669
00:44:22,330 --> 00:44:21,230
bedtime but you weren't bad were you no

670
00:44:24,580 --> 00:44:22,340
okay

671
00:44:27,060 --> 00:44:24,590
I wasn't even in my pajamas it was it

672
00:44:30,010 --> 00:44:27,070
was one of those rare times that we were

673
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:30,020
allowed to be outside you know after

674
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:34,130
dinner and normally right after dinner

675
00:44:38,109 --> 00:44:36,050
we would have taken a bath and then gone

676
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:38,119
to bed shortly afterwards there

677
00:44:40,630 --> 00:44:39,290
endurance

678
00:44:42,700 --> 00:44:40,640
yeah that would have been during school

679
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:42,710
days right this is the summer this was

680
00:44:49,810 --> 00:44:48,050
anytime anytime okay at that point at

681
00:44:53,050 --> 00:44:49,820
that point I was the oldest of five

682
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:53,060
children my mother later had and my

683
00:44:59,080 --> 00:44:55,490
parents later had another one so I'm the

684
00:45:00,580 --> 00:44:59,090
oldest of six but you know when you've

685
00:45:02,860 --> 00:45:00,590
got five kids you want to get them to

686
00:45:04,180 --> 00:45:02,870
bed early so

687
00:45:07,540 --> 00:45:04,190
I think that was the thinking behind

688
00:45:09,100 --> 00:45:07,550
that but I'm not real sure why we were

689
00:45:11,200 --> 00:45:09,110
allowed to stay up a little bit later

690
00:45:14,230 --> 00:45:11,210
you know and why we weren't already you

691
00:45:16,210 --> 00:45:14,240
know up in the bathtub but we were

692
00:45:18,730 --> 00:45:16,220
outside the entire neighborhood was out

693
00:45:21,130 --> 00:45:18,740
there and we were all looking down the

694
00:45:22,510 --> 00:45:21,140
street or up the street you know to me

695
00:45:24,010 --> 00:45:22,520
it seemed like it was down the street

696
00:45:27,460 --> 00:45:24,020
because there was a hill down at the end

697
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:27,470
but we were you know the whole

698
00:45:31,420 --> 00:45:28,970
neighborhood was out looking at these

699
00:45:33,430 --> 00:45:31,430
these UFOs that were flying around up

700
00:45:37,930 --> 00:45:33,440
there and there were about seven of them

701
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:37,940
and you know as near as I can recall I

702
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:40,130
just remember seeing them kind of flying

703
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:43,610
initially in a group and then there were

704
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:44,930
two of them that kind of moved off a

705
00:45:52,300 --> 00:45:48,170
little bit and and then back in again

706
00:45:54,130 --> 00:45:52,310
and it was just you know I didn't really

707
00:45:57,400 --> 00:45:54,140
fully comprehend why everybody was

708
00:46:00,760 --> 00:45:57,410
afraid and everybody was so concerned

709
00:46:02,890 --> 00:46:00,770
about it and then my father who was

710
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:02,900
extremely concerned he went inside the

711
00:46:07,690 --> 00:46:05,210
house he had just made Lieutenant

712
00:46:11,350 --> 00:46:07,700
Colonel five days prior to the defense

713
00:46:13,270 --> 00:46:11,360
event and he was stationed at Andrews

714
00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:13,280
Air Force Base and he was also working

715
00:46:19,570 --> 00:46:16,850
out of the Pentagon and he went in the

716
00:46:21,880 --> 00:46:19,580
house to call the Pentagon and when he

717
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:21,890
came out he was just stone-faced I mean

718
00:46:27,460 --> 00:46:24,050
I can still see the look on his face and

719
00:46:29,650 --> 00:46:27,470
I remember thinking that it had to be

720
00:46:32,110 --> 00:46:29,660
top-secret because I knew he had you

721
00:46:33,940 --> 00:46:32,120
know top-secret security clearance and I

722
00:46:35,260 --> 00:46:33,950
just assumed it was something top-secret

723
00:46:40,300 --> 00:46:35,270
and that's why he wouldn't talk to

724
00:46:43,270 --> 00:46:40,310
anybody about it and so you know the

725
00:46:46,060 --> 00:46:43,280
event didn't last that long for me

726
00:46:48,550 --> 00:46:46,070
because we were eventually you know sent

727
00:46:51,280 --> 00:46:48,560
inside the house to take a bath and go

728
00:46:52,840 --> 00:46:51,290
to bed without that killer or the object

729
00:46:55,660 --> 00:46:52,850
still in the sky when you were sitting

730
00:46:56,890 --> 00:46:55,670
in the house or had they gone home as I

731
00:46:58,300 --> 00:46:56,900
recall everybody was still out there

732
00:47:02,440 --> 00:46:58,310
looking at him when I was not in the

733
00:47:04,630 --> 00:47:02,450
house and can you describe what you saw

734
00:47:07,090 --> 00:47:04,640
I mean did what was it I was so up they

735
00:47:08,230 --> 00:47:07,100
were silver discs they were silver discs

736
00:47:10,990 --> 00:47:08,240
and you could see the sunlight

737
00:47:15,220 --> 00:47:11,000
reflecting off of them solid objects

738
00:47:16,750 --> 00:47:15,230
yeah okay and they were coming I believe

739
00:47:19,210 --> 00:47:16,760
here in the note said they were come

740
00:47:22,060 --> 00:47:19,220
in a southwesterly direction so I

741
00:47:24,250 --> 00:47:22,070
probably like Paul before you

742
00:47:26,020 --> 00:47:24,260
they had already passed over Washington

743
00:47:31,600 --> 00:47:26,030
and we're heading away from Washington

744
00:47:33,220 --> 00:47:31,610
correct I'm not really sure I'm kind of

745
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:33,230
you know after all these years I'm a

746
00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:35,410
little turned around on me

747
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:38,450
that where your bursitis

748
00:47:45,700 --> 00:47:41,450
yeah you say sharply you said Chevrolet

749
00:47:47,290 --> 00:47:45,710
was north east of Washington and so in

750
00:47:49,330 --> 00:47:47,300
your notices they were they were flying

751
00:47:51,220 --> 00:47:49,340
south westerly which would have been

752
00:47:54,010 --> 00:47:51,230
away from Washington right

753
00:47:55,590 --> 00:47:54,020
okay probably maybe we'll give that a

754
00:47:58,660 --> 00:47:55,600
definite maybe

755
00:48:03,150 --> 00:47:58,670
hey a little water has gone under the

756
00:48:06,370 --> 00:48:03,160
bridge since 1952 hasn't it yeah okay

757
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:06,380
well now so that actually was your

758
00:48:10,450 --> 00:48:08,570
experienced it was there ever any okay

759
00:48:11,860 --> 00:48:10,460
was there any in your thought then or

760
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:11,870
now that maybe it was some sort of

761
00:48:21,850 --> 00:48:16,970
natural phenomena no and one of the

762
00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:21,860
things about oh somewhere between 15 and

763
00:48:27,820 --> 00:48:24,890
20 years ago I was here visiting my dad

764
00:48:31,690 --> 00:48:27,830
and I was living in California at the

765
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:31,700
time and we were sitting in his kitchen

766
00:48:36,580 --> 00:48:34,010
table and we were talking about UFOs and

767
00:48:38,770 --> 00:48:36,590
stuff and I said well well what was the

768
00:48:42,010 --> 00:48:38,780
whole deal when you went in and and call

769
00:48:44,230 --> 00:48:42,020
the Pentagon in 1952 when you know they

770
00:48:46,780 --> 00:48:44,240
were flying over and and he started

771
00:48:49,180 --> 00:48:46,790
laughing and he said the reason that he

772
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:49,190
was so stone-faced when he came back out

773
00:48:53,650 --> 00:48:51,890
is because he was just livid because

774
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:53,660
when you and I am called Pentagon they

775
00:48:57,100 --> 00:48:55,130
treated him like a nutjob

776
00:48:59,970 --> 00:48:57,110
now you have to keep in mind that my dad

777
00:49:04,030 --> 00:48:59,980
was an experienced world war two pilots

778
00:49:06,670 --> 00:49:04,040
he was also the first pilot to fly into

779
00:49:08,290 --> 00:49:06,680
Orly France after d-day he said

780
00:49:10,990 --> 00:49:08,300
generally and to meet with General de

781
00:49:16,240 --> 00:49:11,000
Gaulle and you know so he was no dummy

782
00:49:18,430 --> 00:49:16,250
when it came to aeronautics and so he

783
00:49:20,470 --> 00:49:18,440
was just he was so infuriated by the

784
00:49:21,730 --> 00:49:20,480
fact that they treated him like a nutjob

785
00:49:23,650 --> 00:49:21,740
that that's why he wouldn't talk to

786
00:49:26,620 --> 00:49:23,660
anybody about it it had nothing to do

787
00:49:28,300 --> 00:49:26,630
with anything being top-secret Wow that

788
00:49:30,070 --> 00:49:28,310
so in other words he got the same

789
00:49:32,410 --> 00:49:30,080
brush-off that earlier Paul

790
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:32,420
said he did when as these its

791
00:49:36,700 --> 00:49:34,610
intelligence analyst he tried to tell me

792
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:36,710
was going on and of course I do

793
00:49:42,190 --> 00:49:39,290
understand that at the time the

794
00:49:44,770 --> 00:49:42,200
switchboards the newspapers the police

795
00:49:46,720 --> 00:49:44,780
were just inundated with calls from

796
00:49:52,390 --> 00:49:46,730
people you know saying here's what I saw

797
00:49:54,430 --> 00:49:52,400
or what is right yeah I think you know

798
00:49:58,000 --> 00:49:54,440
back then a lot of people were really

799
00:50:01,270 --> 00:49:58,010
scared you know I think it was too soon

800
00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:01,280
after were of the world I think people

801
00:50:06,100 --> 00:50:04,370
thought we were being invaded and you

802
00:50:09,310 --> 00:50:06,110
know so that's understandable why at

803
00:50:11,500 --> 00:50:09,320
that time people we're that's for a good

804
00:50:13,270 --> 00:50:11,510
point Vivian because you know today war

805
00:50:14,620 --> 00:50:13,280
the Orson Welles War the world

806
00:50:17,290 --> 00:50:14,630
you know this sounds like ancient

807
00:50:20,530 --> 00:50:17,300
history but in 1950 that was less than

808
00:50:23,350 --> 00:50:20,540
15 years after that was like you know

809
00:50:25,780 --> 00:50:23,360
like somebody talked about 9/11 now you

810
00:50:27,730 --> 00:50:25,790
know it was still very fresh and a lot

811
00:50:29,080 --> 00:50:27,740
of people's minds well I mean you know

812
00:50:30,820 --> 00:50:29,090
there were a lot of people that caused

813
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:30,830
so much panic there were people that

814
00:50:35,260 --> 00:50:32,810
committed suicide even and there were

815
00:50:37,240 --> 00:50:35,270
people that you know took guns and stuff

816
00:50:39,310 --> 00:50:37,250
and went off into the hills to hide out

817
00:50:41,620 --> 00:50:39,320
and you know people thought it was real

818
00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:41,630
you know they thought all this was real

819
00:50:46,390 --> 00:50:44,330
and so you know it was and this was when

820
00:50:49,060 --> 00:50:46,400
in the late 40s when Orson Welles did

821
00:50:51,430 --> 00:50:49,070
that actually about nine children flirty

822
00:50:54,460 --> 00:50:51,440
30 I would think it was in the forties

823
00:50:57,070 --> 00:50:54,470
but still say that would have been like

824
00:50:59,470 --> 00:50:57,080
14 years thirteen fourteen years yep so

825
00:51:02,650 --> 00:50:59,480
people were still you know in that panic

826
00:51:04,240 --> 00:51:02,660
mode and you could see that just by

827
00:51:06,310 --> 00:51:04,250
looking at the people up and down my

828
00:51:08,770 --> 00:51:06,320
street you know if you look at that

829
00:51:10,420 --> 00:51:08,780
Street now I've gone to V Pike and

830
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:10,430
looked at it and there's big trees on it

831
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:12,050
and everybody's front yard well when we

832
00:51:15,340 --> 00:51:14,090
lived there there were no trees at all

833
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:15,350
in anybody's yard

834
00:51:20,500 --> 00:51:18,170
there were woods behind us but we had a

835
00:51:23,980 --> 00:51:20,510
very clear view of what was going on

836
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:23,990
right right well enough another thing I

837
00:51:32,980 --> 00:51:30,770
might add here is that 1952 was only

838
00:51:37,660 --> 00:51:32,990
seven years after World War two ended

839
00:51:42,010 --> 00:51:37,670
and the nation was still very much in a

840
00:51:43,780 --> 00:51:42,020
war security mainframe yeah oh yeah we

841
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:43,790
used to have have drills where we'd have

842
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:44,130
to

843
00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:46,650
you know get under the desk and you know

844
00:51:50,690 --> 00:51:49,410
they do they have the alarms go off and

845
00:51:52,970 --> 00:51:50,700
everybody in the school would have to

846
00:51:54,320 --> 00:51:52,980
get under the desk they were you know in

847
00:51:57,920 --> 00:51:54,330
case somebody was going to come bomb

848
00:52:00,860 --> 00:51:57,930
this and so we're still in that mindset

849
00:52:02,690 --> 00:52:00,870
we did that also in Texas and of course

850
00:52:06,710 --> 00:52:02,700
let me remind the little younger

851
00:52:09,950 --> 00:52:06,720
listeners this was right at right after

852
00:52:12,050 --> 00:52:09,960
that several years after Winston

853
00:52:16,810 --> 00:52:12,060
Churchill had declared an Iron Curtain

854
00:52:20,210 --> 00:52:16,820
in Europe and we were already being

855
00:52:23,300 --> 00:52:20,220
conditioned to be fearful of the Russian

856
00:52:24,980 --> 00:52:23,310
communists in World War 3 and of course

857
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:24,990
the Cold War went on for a good number

858
00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:26,850
of years and this was the beginning of

859
00:52:33,110 --> 00:52:29,850
it but this was also the beginning of

860
00:52:37,390 --> 00:52:33,120
the McCarthy era you know paranoia runs

861
00:52:40,750 --> 00:52:37,400
deep and you have to put that into the

862
00:52:43,640 --> 00:52:40,760
context of what was gone at that time

863
00:52:45,980 --> 00:52:43,650
since then Vivian I know you've studied

864
00:52:50,650 --> 00:52:45,990
the phenomena and you've gone out as an

865
00:52:53,870 --> 00:52:50,660
investigator for now - at least - UFO

866
00:52:57,230 --> 00:52:53,880
investigation organizations and I'm sure

867
00:52:59,150 --> 00:52:57,240
that you've seen the arguments that what

868
00:53:01,430 --> 00:52:59,160
everyone saw over Washington was

869
00:53:04,130 --> 00:53:01,440
actually just lights reflected off of

870
00:53:07,630 --> 00:53:04,140
temperature inversions just different

871
00:53:08,870 --> 00:53:07,640
levels that happens Thank You Lonnie

872
00:53:10,790 --> 00:53:08,880
yeah

873
00:53:15,370 --> 00:53:10,800
absolutely because you know I think it

874
00:53:21,280 --> 00:53:15,380
was only maybe as a year before that the

875
00:53:24,770 --> 00:53:21,290
Lubbock lights that took place in 1951

876
00:53:26,300 --> 00:53:24,780
about a year earlier I went out there to

877
00:53:29,570 --> 00:53:26,310
work on the newspaper at the Louisville

878
00:53:32,480 --> 00:53:29,580
Avalanche Journal back in the mid-60s

879
00:53:34,940 --> 00:53:32,490
and one of the old photographers there

880
00:53:38,810 --> 00:53:34,950
had been a photographer for the Lubbock

881
00:53:40,940 --> 00:53:38,820
newspaper in the early 1950s in fact had

882
00:53:43,550 --> 00:53:40,950
taken pictures of what became known as

883
00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:43,560
the Lubbock lights which was a series of

884
00:53:49,940 --> 00:53:46,530
glowing objects in a v-shaped formation

885
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:49,950
that pass low slowly over the town of

886
00:53:54,950 --> 00:53:51,810
Lubbock Texas way out in West Texas and

887
00:53:56,680 --> 00:53:54,960
I remember asking em one time I said

888
00:53:58,690 --> 00:53:56,690
well you know the government

889
00:54:01,720 --> 00:53:58,700
you said it was just street lights

890
00:54:05,050 --> 00:54:01,730
shining off the underside of a flight of

891
00:54:07,990 --> 00:54:05,060
plumbers which is a kind of duck and he

892
00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:08,000
said yeah they said it was duck butts

893
00:54:14,170 --> 00:54:11,930
right he he never bought that and he

894
00:54:16,390 --> 00:54:14,180
actually saw him and took photographs of

895
00:54:19,359 --> 00:54:16,400
them so they've really just really

896
00:54:21,280 --> 00:54:19,369
handed us a bunch of dissembling

897
00:54:23,500 --> 00:54:21,290
disinformation over the years haven't

898
00:54:25,300 --> 00:54:23,510
they didn't they really have and it's

899
00:54:27,579 --> 00:54:25,310
it's really insulting to people's

900
00:54:29,260 --> 00:54:27,589
intelligence you know to for the

901
00:54:32,050 --> 00:54:29,270
government to come up with these

902
00:54:34,210 --> 00:54:32,060
ridiculous stories you know some of us

903
00:54:36,220 --> 00:54:34,220
have seen things that we know for a fact

904
00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:36,230
or real that we've seen up close and

905
00:54:41,700 --> 00:54:39,650
personal and for anybody to say that

906
00:54:45,339 --> 00:54:41,710
it's anything else is just ludicrous

907
00:54:47,589 --> 00:54:45,349
well they you know we have the documents

908
00:54:48,940 --> 00:54:47,599
now showing that starting back at the

909
00:54:54,370 --> 00:54:48,950
very time we're talking to about about

910
00:54:57,300 --> 00:54:54,380
nineteen fifty-one 52 53 that a policy

911
00:55:01,780 --> 00:54:57,310
was actually officially instigated of

912
00:55:03,550 --> 00:55:01,790
denial and ridicule they said you didn't

913
00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:03,560
see anything if you keep insisting you

914
00:55:08,319 --> 00:55:04,970
did then you might need psychiatric

915
00:55:10,510 --> 00:55:08,329
treatment well you know that is that's

916
00:55:13,120 --> 00:55:10,520
just uncomfortable because not only as

917
00:55:15,839 --> 00:55:13,130
it's so contrary to the truth but

918
00:55:18,819 --> 00:55:15,849
wouldn't you agree that that's probably

919
00:55:20,740 --> 00:55:18,829
caused a lot of psychological damage to

920
00:55:24,670 --> 00:55:20,750
a lot of people and maybe even broken up

921
00:55:26,890 --> 00:55:24,680
families oh I agree I've talked to a

922
00:55:30,190 --> 00:55:26,900
number of people over the years that you

923
00:55:32,230 --> 00:55:30,200
know I've actually had that happen you

924
00:55:35,859 --> 00:55:32,240
know I of course can't say names but I

925
00:55:40,329 --> 00:55:35,869
do know of one person a couple of years

926
00:55:44,230 --> 00:55:40,339
ago that because of her involvement in

927
00:55:45,760 --> 00:55:44,240
this it caused a divorce and I've heard

928
00:55:47,620 --> 00:55:45,770
of other people over the years as well

929
00:55:50,319 --> 00:55:47,630
but it had the same kind of problem and

930
00:55:51,910 --> 00:55:50,329
I think it's really sad that our

931
00:55:54,940 --> 00:55:51,920
government doesn't come forward and say

932
00:55:56,500 --> 00:55:54,950
yeah this is a real thing and I realize

933
00:55:57,760 --> 00:55:56,510
the reason they don't do it is because

934
00:56:01,300 --> 00:55:57,770
they don't want to even if they have no

935
00:56:04,150 --> 00:56:01,310
control of do the airspace yeah that's

936
00:56:06,370 --> 00:56:04,160
that's very real problem because if

937
00:56:10,210 --> 00:56:06,380
you'll think about it

938
00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:10,220
the only real rationale for

939
00:56:16,359 --> 00:56:12,890
having a any kind of real structured

940
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:16,369
government in the first place is one of

941
00:56:24,400 --> 00:56:21,770
the two obligations responsibilities

942
00:56:27,040 --> 00:56:24,410
given to government in our Constitution

943
00:56:29,380 --> 00:56:27,050
one of course is to coin regulate money

944
00:56:32,410 --> 00:56:29,390
in tariffs the other is to provide for

945
00:56:35,050 --> 00:56:32,420
the common defense okay the fifth to

946
00:56:36,760 --> 00:56:35,060
provide for defense well you can see

947
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:36,770
that if they were forced to come out and

948
00:56:40,990 --> 00:56:38,450
say well there's things planned over our

949
00:56:43,720 --> 00:56:41,000
most restricted airspace and we're not

950
00:56:46,540 --> 00:56:43,730
even not only sure of who they are but

951
00:56:48,220 --> 00:56:46,550
we can't do anything about it then you

952
00:56:53,010 --> 00:56:48,230
know everyone would be saying well then

953
00:56:55,690 --> 00:56:53,020
why am i paying taxes right yeah really

954
00:56:58,690 --> 00:56:55,700
that's it well listen I understand that

955
00:57:03,280 --> 00:56:58,700
your dad who he finally did he retire as

956
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:03,290
a full colonel yes he had another

957
00:57:10,150 --> 00:57:09,170
experience too when you my only son yes

958
00:57:13,390 --> 00:57:10,160
tell us about that

959
00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:13,400
that was in 1967 and he was flying a

960
00:57:19,390 --> 00:57:15,650
mission overlay overlay us for about

961
00:57:24,160 --> 00:57:19,400
25,000 feet and he was flying a c-130

962
00:57:25,870 --> 00:57:24,170
and they were flying parallel to the

963
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:25,880
equator and they go so many miles and

964
00:57:31,390 --> 00:57:28,250
then turn and stays parallel to the

965
00:57:32,829 --> 00:57:31,400
equator and fly back and he didn't go

966
00:57:34,599 --> 00:57:32,839
into detail about what the mission was

967
00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:34,609
just that they were going along and it

968
00:57:39,190 --> 00:57:36,890
was a perfectly clear day and all of a

969
00:57:41,740 --> 00:57:39,200
sudden this craft came from out of

970
00:57:44,770 --> 00:57:41,750
nowhere and and I had on collision

971
00:57:47,400 --> 00:57:44,780
course for this plane and at the last

972
00:57:49,930 --> 00:57:47,410
moment it went underneath his plane and

973
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:49,940
for some reason I didn't think until

974
00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:51,890
after his death that I should have asked

975
00:57:57,579 --> 00:57:54,050
him if it caused any kind of turbulence

976
00:57:59,260 --> 00:57:57,589
or what but he said that it just you

977
00:58:04,990 --> 00:57:59,270
know to quote him he said it scared the

978
00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:05,000
hell out of him and did he ever give you

979
00:58:08,589 --> 00:58:06,290
a description

980
00:58:10,839 --> 00:58:08,599
he didn't you do better than that he did

981
00:58:13,089 --> 00:58:10,849
a drawing for me of the craft and he

982
00:58:15,579 --> 00:58:13,099
wrote down you know what had happened

983
00:58:19,210 --> 00:58:15,589
and what how he was flying and you know

984
00:58:21,670 --> 00:58:19,220
etc since we can't see the drawing can

985
00:58:24,190 --> 00:58:21,680
you describe it well it was shaped like

986
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:24,200
like the hull of a boat and

987
00:58:31,349 --> 00:58:26,930
this craft had he saw no windows on it

988
00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:31,359
at all and there wasn't anything

989
00:58:40,150 --> 00:58:33,410
distinguishable about it other than it

990
00:58:45,220 --> 00:58:40,160
was silver and the interesting thing is

991
00:58:46,750 --> 00:58:45,230
that at some other point I had been

992
00:58:49,300 --> 00:58:46,760
researching some stuff on the internet

993
00:58:51,940 --> 00:58:49,310
this as years ago and I came across a

994
00:58:53,830 --> 00:58:51,950
craft that somebody had drawn and put on

995
00:58:57,940 --> 00:58:53,840
the internet that looked very much like

996
00:58:59,380 --> 00:58:57,950
the one that he had drawn for me and so

997
00:59:02,859 --> 00:58:59,390
I thought I don't know where that person

998
00:59:04,260 --> 00:59:02,869
got that drawing or anything I mean for

999
00:59:07,720 --> 00:59:04,270
all I know it could have been the

1000
00:59:09,580 --> 00:59:07,730
copilot that was with him because they

1001
00:59:11,530 --> 00:59:09,590
decided not to report it they had done

1002
00:59:15,310 --> 00:59:11,540
its kind of talk about it for a minute

1003
00:59:18,070 --> 00:59:15,320
and we regretted their motor sorry not

1004
00:59:19,720 --> 00:59:18,080
to report it because it would have gone

1005
00:59:22,420 --> 00:59:19,730
into their ears and affected their

1006
00:59:24,730 --> 00:59:22,430
ability to get promoted right and our

1007
00:59:30,030 --> 00:59:24,740
another possibility is it was just the

1008
00:59:33,700 --> 00:59:30,040
same modeled UFO right right somebody

1009
00:59:37,690 --> 00:59:33,710
similar object yeah I thought of that

1010
00:59:39,790 --> 00:59:37,700
too but he in fact he and I used to have

1011
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:39,800
some quite quite a few discussions about

1012
00:59:45,750 --> 00:59:42,890
it because he was convinced that they

1013
00:59:48,430 --> 00:59:45,760
came from other dimensions or through

1014
00:59:50,460 --> 00:59:48,440
dimensions because of the fact that this

1015
00:59:53,109 --> 00:59:50,470
thing literally came from out of nowhere

1016
00:59:55,540 --> 00:59:53,119
they didn't see it coming up well when

1017
00:59:57,040 --> 00:59:55,550
you said it went under their plane did

1018
00:59:59,770 --> 00:59:57,050
he give you any indication of whether

1019
01:00:02,740 --> 00:59:59,780
this was they were just following the

1020
01:00:06,579 --> 01:00:02,750
UFO was following a flight path or did

1021
01:00:08,740 --> 01:00:06,589
it change course no it changed course

1022
01:00:11,370 --> 01:00:08,750
and when underneath his plane to avoid

1023
01:00:14,250 --> 01:00:11,380
the collision well then that air okay

1024
01:00:17,079 --> 01:00:14,260
intelligent direction yes exactly

1025
01:00:18,820 --> 01:00:17,089
okay that's what it was because it was

1026
01:00:21,130 --> 01:00:18,830
coming in a head-on collision course

1027
01:00:24,190 --> 01:00:21,140
when it came from out of nowhere and and

1028
01:00:28,180 --> 01:00:24,200
then just drove under the plane at the

1029
01:00:30,310 --> 01:00:28,190
last moment what do you say when you ask

1030
01:00:33,490 --> 01:00:30,320
him if he'd been debriefed about what

1031
01:00:35,589 --> 01:00:33,500
happened when he got on the ground he

1032
01:00:37,150 --> 01:00:35,599
said he wasn't because they didn't

1033
01:00:38,500 --> 01:00:37,160
report it

1034
01:00:40,690 --> 01:00:38,510
they knew that they were recorded it

1035
01:00:43,349 --> 01:00:40,700
that they'd never get a rank again they

1036
01:00:45,490 --> 01:00:43,359
never get promoted again you know it was

1037
01:00:46,930 --> 01:00:45,500
you know they kind of talked about it

1038
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:46,940
for a minute and they decided now they

1039
01:00:50,740 --> 01:00:48,410
weren't going to say a word because it

1040
01:00:54,880 --> 01:00:50,750
would have gone in the ER you know

1041
01:00:58,630 --> 01:00:54,890
Vivian that's still going on I know I

1042
01:01:01,480 --> 01:00:58,640
heard a story from some pilots and they

1043
01:01:04,569 --> 01:01:01,490
radioed the ATC the air traffic

1044
01:01:06,789 --> 01:01:04,579
controller and said you know I've got a

1045
01:01:09,430 --> 01:01:06,799
UFO over here on my right wing and it's

1046
01:01:11,680 --> 01:01:09,440
very huge and it's silver and it's it's

1047
01:01:15,670 --> 01:01:11,690
pacing us and the pilot was just all

1048
01:01:18,430 --> 01:01:15,680
excited and the ATC radio back and said

1049
01:01:23,650 --> 01:01:18,440
are you reporting a UFO and there's a

1050
01:01:27,630 --> 01:01:23,660
long silence and the pilot said no yeah

1051
01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:27,640
very calmly yeah they were gently

1052
01:01:33,099 --> 01:01:30,410
unfortunately and that's why that the

1053
01:01:35,710 --> 01:01:33,109
man in the street is still you know

1054
01:01:40,529 --> 01:01:35,720
being titillated on the one hand with

1055
01:01:44,200 --> 01:01:40,539
ETS and and spaceships and you know the

1056
01:01:46,269 --> 01:01:44,210
the USS Enterprise and everything else

1057
01:01:51,010 --> 01:01:46,279
on TV and yet when it comes to the news

1058
01:01:53,260 --> 01:01:51,020
it's like nothing there folks yes really

1059
01:01:55,450 --> 01:01:53,270
it's very frustrating you know and

1060
01:01:57,940 --> 01:01:55,460
especially when people get really good

1061
01:02:00,160 --> 01:01:57,950
photographs or video or anything they do

1062
01:02:03,609 --> 01:02:00,170
everything they can to discredit it and

1063
01:02:07,720 --> 01:02:03,619
it's just really unfortunate well the

1064
01:02:11,760 --> 01:02:07,730
only bright spot is that at least to me

1065
01:02:14,380 --> 01:02:11,770
this is changing I know when the

1066
01:02:16,299 --> 01:02:14,390
sightings over Stephenville occurred

1067
01:02:19,299 --> 01:02:16,309
here a couple years ago here in Texas

1068
01:02:20,980 --> 01:02:19,309
certainly the Texas media and I think to

1069
01:02:23,829 --> 01:02:20,990
a pretty good extent the national media

1070
01:02:26,200 --> 01:02:23,839
actually began reporting on that and a

1071
01:02:28,809 --> 01:02:26,210
fairly straightforward reportorial style

1072
01:02:31,120 --> 01:02:28,819
rather than just sneering and laughing

1073
01:02:33,450 --> 01:02:31,130
and say oh well look what the Hicks and

1074
01:02:36,130 --> 01:02:33,460
Texas are saying right you remember that

1075
01:02:38,349 --> 01:02:36,140
and you would you agree that the

1076
01:02:40,839 --> 01:02:38,359
attitude is changing I think it's

1077
01:02:43,870 --> 01:02:40,849
changed a little bit and I you know but

1078
01:02:46,660 --> 01:02:43,880
I've also seen in the last several years

1079
01:02:48,700 --> 01:02:46,670
- I've seen where you know something

1080
01:02:50,920 --> 01:02:48,710
will be reported and the local news

1081
01:02:53,020 --> 01:02:50,930
media as a reporting at those

1082
01:02:55,660 --> 01:02:53,030
snicker and they make jokes about it you

1083
01:02:57,370 --> 01:02:55,670
know they don't really treat it all that

1084
01:02:59,140 --> 01:02:57,380
seriously and I think that kind of

1085
01:03:01,630 --> 01:02:59,150
contributes to the overall problem

1086
01:03:02,140 --> 01:03:01,640
nobody wants to be humiliated or made a

1087
01:03:06,160 --> 01:03:02,150
fool of

1088
01:03:08,799 --> 01:03:06,170
and unfortunately that's what's been

1089
01:03:11,280 --> 01:03:08,809
going on for a long time well and that's

1090
01:03:13,750 --> 01:03:11,290
probably caused you problems in your

1091
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:13,760
investigations because how many people

1092
01:03:18,339 --> 01:03:16,010
have said well I'll tell you what I saw

1093
01:03:20,200 --> 01:03:18,349
but don't use my name or they'll say no

1094
01:03:22,240 --> 01:03:20,210
I don't want to talk to you I wanted I

1095
01:03:23,740 --> 01:03:22,250
don't want to be laughed at or nobody

1096
01:03:26,109 --> 01:03:23,750
believed me I'm sure you've heard all of

1097
01:03:28,299 --> 01:03:26,119
that well not only as I heard all that

1098
01:03:31,180 --> 01:03:28,309
but I was there at one time myself I

1099
01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:31,190
wouldn't I mean if I even brought the

1100
01:03:39,670 --> 01:03:34,930
subject up I have people say to me well

1101
01:03:41,650 --> 01:03:39,680
what are you smoking I've also heard him

1102
01:03:43,780 --> 01:03:41,660
say whatever you're drinking I'll have

1103
01:03:45,880 --> 01:03:43,790
the same thing you know I mean I make

1104
01:03:47,079 --> 01:03:45,890
jokes out of it and so you you know you

1105
01:03:50,470 --> 01:03:47,089
get to where you don't want to talk

1106
01:03:52,240 --> 01:03:50,480
about it then that it was like that for

1107
01:03:54,700 --> 01:03:52,250
a lot of years for me and I wouldn't

1108
01:03:57,460 --> 01:03:54,710
talk about my own experiences I wouldn't

1109
01:04:00,480 --> 01:03:57,470
talk about any of it and you know I got

1110
01:04:04,660 --> 01:04:00,490
fabulous photographs I've taken and I

1111
01:04:07,420 --> 01:04:04,670
keep negatives I keep original disc you

1112
01:04:09,490 --> 01:04:07,430
know of certain ones because I don't

1113
01:04:11,559 --> 01:04:09,500
want anybody ever saying I you know

1114
01:04:14,770 --> 01:04:11,569
played with something in Photoshop and

1115
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:14,780
did this or did that so I think it's

1116
01:04:18,130 --> 01:04:16,730
really important for people to know that

1117
01:04:23,160 --> 01:04:18,140
if they do get something to keep

1118
01:04:26,460 --> 01:04:23,170
originals and to document everything

1119
01:04:29,799 --> 01:04:26,470
documenting is very important to

1120
01:04:32,890 --> 01:04:29,809
everyone listening let me write down

1121
01:04:35,530 --> 01:04:32,900
this number here's a call-in number I'm

1122
01:04:38,740 --> 01:04:35,540
sure that they're the the chat room is

1123
01:04:40,930 --> 01:04:38,750
just bursting with questions we've got

1124
01:04:42,160 --> 01:04:40,940
to have some technical difficulties here

1125
01:04:44,109 --> 01:04:42,170
I'm trying to get some of these

1126
01:04:47,829 --> 01:04:44,119
questions passed along but in the

1127
01:04:51,220 --> 01:04:47,839
meantime write down eight eight eight

1128
01:04:54,670 --> 01:04:51,230
nine one nine two three five five

1129
01:04:58,839 --> 01:04:54,680
there's a call-in number and they would

1130
01:05:01,510 --> 01:04:58,849
get you on we've got oh just less than

1131
01:05:04,640 --> 01:05:01,520
twenty minutes to go but especially with

1132
01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:04,650
Vivian Walker here and experienced UFO

1133
01:05:11,420 --> 01:05:07,410
investigator and now the state director

1134
01:05:13,789 --> 01:05:11,430
for epic and Louisiana and myself who's

1135
01:05:18,200 --> 01:05:13,799
been kicking around looking at UFOs

1136
01:05:21,289 --> 01:05:18,210
since that early fifties mid 50s and I

1137
01:05:23,990 --> 01:05:21,299
improve it because I I when I was about

1138
01:05:27,529 --> 01:05:24,000
14 years old I did a watercolor painting

1139
01:05:29,779 --> 01:05:27,539
of the UFO landing on a Texas Highway it

1140
01:05:32,349 --> 01:05:29,789
was based on newspaper accounts of an

1141
01:05:35,420 --> 01:05:32,359
incident they had out in Levelland Texas

1142
01:05:38,440 --> 01:05:35,430
way back 250 so I've been out of the

1143
01:05:42,470 --> 01:05:38,450
wild - so you've got two experienced

1144
01:05:43,940 --> 01:05:42,480
people here with UFOs and attendant

1145
01:05:47,420 --> 01:05:43,950
things so if you've got a question call

1146
01:05:50,539 --> 01:05:47,430
eight eight eight nine one nine two

1147
01:05:55,279 --> 01:05:50,549
three five five that's eight eight eight

1148
01:05:58,160 --> 01:05:55,289
nine one nine two three five five hope

1149
01:06:00,049 --> 01:05:58,170
to get some calls in meanwhile Vivian

1150
01:06:02,059 --> 01:06:00,059
tell me what if you got coming up if you

1151
01:06:03,529 --> 01:06:02,069
got any good cases that you're getting

1152
01:06:05,660 --> 01:06:03,539
ready to look into or are you just

1153
01:06:07,809 --> 01:06:05,670
waiting with your bags packed for

1154
01:06:10,130 --> 01:06:07,819
something actually I've been

1155
01:06:12,440 --> 01:06:10,140
investigating a case that is extremely

1156
01:06:14,089 --> 01:06:12,450
interesting it's probably the most

1157
01:06:18,829 --> 01:06:14,099
interesting one I've ever been

1158
01:06:23,779 --> 01:06:18,839
associated with and there the person

1159
01:06:28,339 --> 01:06:23,789
involved had filmed an entity sometime

1160
01:06:30,170 --> 01:06:28,349
back that was in her backyard and it was

1161
01:06:35,630 --> 01:06:30,180
also witnessed by her some of her

1162
01:06:36,980 --> 01:06:35,640
children and when she was she finally

1163
01:06:38,569 --> 01:06:36,990
had the presence of mind to get the

1164
01:06:43,519 --> 01:06:38,579
camera and take a pitch you know take a

1165
01:06:48,650 --> 01:06:43,529
movie of it she had about 40 minutes at

1166
01:06:51,349 --> 01:06:48,660
elapsed and she filmed this entity and

1167
01:06:56,059 --> 01:06:51,359
it was it appeared to be injured and was

1168
01:06:57,500 --> 01:06:56,069
rolling around on the ground and the she

1169
01:06:59,809 --> 01:06:57,510
was talking to her girlfriend on the

1170
01:07:01,549 --> 01:06:59,819
phone while she was filming and you can

1171
01:07:03,680 --> 01:07:01,559
hear that she's really really afraid I

1172
01:07:07,250 --> 01:07:03,690
mean she thought this this creature was

1173
01:07:08,900 --> 01:07:07,260
a demon and she was so afraid and her

1174
01:07:10,370 --> 01:07:08,910
girlfriend came to pick her up and when

1175
01:07:12,799 --> 01:07:10,380
her girlfriend pulled up in the front

1176
01:07:16,700 --> 01:07:12,809
there was another entity around front

1177
01:07:18,109 --> 01:07:16,710
that was wearing a hooded cape and it

1178
01:07:21,019 --> 01:07:18,119
ran when

1179
01:07:23,509 --> 01:07:21,029
lights hit it so it's a really

1180
01:07:27,109 --> 01:07:23,519
compelling case and there's lots of

1181
01:07:29,569 --> 01:07:27,119
evidence and lots of witnesses and so

1182
01:07:32,299 --> 01:07:29,579
this is what I've been investigating Wow

1183
01:07:33,950 --> 01:07:32,309
sounds like you're really going have you

1184
01:07:35,660 --> 01:07:33,960
had a chance to look at the film

1185
01:07:38,870 --> 01:07:35,670
yourself oh yeah

1186
01:07:41,989 --> 01:07:38,880
and she has the original and what I have

1187
01:07:45,559 --> 01:07:41,999
is a copy and down excuse me my

1188
01:07:47,450 --> 01:07:45,569
allergies anyway time to don't worry

1189
01:07:51,710 --> 01:07:47,460
about it this is this is five time of

1190
01:07:53,809 --> 01:07:51,720
year yeah Carol and I losing my voice so

1191
01:07:57,799 --> 01:07:53,819
well before your voice goes quick tell

1192
01:08:00,170 --> 01:07:57,809
us what did you see what it look like um

1193
01:08:01,940 --> 01:08:00,180
well it was a it was a small creature

1194
01:08:05,839 --> 01:08:01,950
that they're about three and a half feet

1195
01:08:07,460 --> 01:08:05,849
tall and it was you can see in the film

1196
01:08:10,430 --> 01:08:07,470
where it was shooting something out of

1197
01:08:12,019 --> 01:08:10,440
his eyes you know right and she thought

1198
01:08:14,630 --> 01:08:12,029
that it was directed at her that's why

1199
01:08:16,370 --> 01:08:14,640
she was so afraid and she doesn't know

1200
01:08:18,740 --> 01:08:16,380
why it was injured she did have three

1201
01:08:21,680 --> 01:08:18,750
dogs and the dogs were on her back porch

1202
01:08:23,450 --> 01:08:21,690
and they just weren't moving but we

1203
01:08:27,649 --> 01:08:23,460
think that maybe the dogs have attacked

1204
01:08:30,379 --> 01:08:27,659
it and so soil samples were taken and I

1205
01:08:33,919 --> 01:08:30,389
won't mention by who more right who or

1206
01:08:35,890 --> 01:08:33,929
what have worked organization and the

1207
01:08:42,260 --> 01:08:35,900
soil samples seem to have disappeared

1208
01:08:44,030 --> 01:08:42,270
and or is a lot of confusion as to where

1209
01:08:46,220 --> 01:08:44,040
a lot of things went involving this case

1210
01:08:49,599 --> 01:08:46,230
and it took me quite some time to get

1211
01:08:53,539 --> 01:08:49,609
all the evidence together that was

1212
01:08:57,349 --> 01:08:53,549
gotten a number of years back excuse me

1213
01:08:59,180 --> 01:08:57,359
and the only thing we still don't have

1214
01:09:01,399 --> 01:08:59,190
are the soil samples which is really

1215
01:09:06,829 --> 01:09:01,409
ashamed because there was possible DNA

1216
01:09:08,149 --> 01:09:06,839
on it right baby analysts I can't tell

1217
01:09:10,700 --> 01:09:08,159
you how much I appreciate you being with

1218
01:09:15,709 --> 01:09:10,710
us tonight and let's give your voice a

1219
01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:15,719
rest here is there anything goes we've

1220
01:09:20,269 --> 01:09:18,690
got some callers on the line so unless

1221
01:09:25,160 --> 01:09:20,279
you have something else you need to add

1222
01:09:28,899 --> 01:09:25,170
anything else no I think that's probably

1223
01:09:31,990 --> 01:09:28,909
all for now well I thank you so much for

1224
01:09:35,780 --> 01:09:32,000
adding to our knowledge about the

1225
01:09:37,990 --> 01:09:35,790
19:52 flower over washington and join us

1226
01:09:41,930 --> 01:09:38,000
and that B&H the second of eye witnesses

1227
01:09:44,600 --> 01:09:41,940
that saw that and as we heard neither

1228
01:09:45,830 --> 01:09:44,610
one are buying into the story that it

1229
01:09:48,380 --> 01:09:45,840
was just some sort of natural

1230
01:09:52,460 --> 01:09:48,390
temperature inversions actually i do

1231
01:09:54,350 --> 01:09:52,470
when i add one more okay a friend of

1232
01:09:55,820 --> 01:09:54,360
mine and i won't say his name because i

1233
01:09:58,580 --> 01:09:55,830
don't know if he wants to be involved or

1234
01:10:01,640 --> 01:09:58,590
not he's a retired lieutenant colonel

1235
01:10:05,660 --> 01:10:01,650
and he was a pilot and he was a teenager

1236
01:10:09,920 --> 01:10:05,670
and living near the same area and saw

1237
01:10:13,130 --> 01:10:09,930
the UFOs as well in 1952 so that was

1238
01:10:15,140 --> 01:10:13,140
another pilot but he wasn't a pilot at

1239
01:10:17,810 --> 01:10:15,150
the time of course but right but he

1240
01:10:20,900 --> 01:10:17,820
knows what he saw - exactly

1241
01:10:23,750 --> 01:10:20,910
Vivian thank you so much for being with

1242
01:10:30,290 --> 01:10:23,760
us and good luck to you on your epic

1243
01:10:32,720 --> 01:10:30,300
voyage thank you alright we we have a

1244
01:10:36,620 --> 01:10:32,730
caller now from air code five five nine

1245
01:10:38,660 --> 01:10:36,630
is the caller on the line hello how are

1246
01:10:45,620 --> 01:10:38,670
you this evening this is Dottie can you

1247
01:10:48,350 --> 01:10:45,630
hey Donny I guess I'm just lovely my

1248
01:10:50,060 --> 01:10:48,360
head exciting the setting that I had

1249
01:10:52,220 --> 01:10:50,070
they were they were colored like they

1250
01:10:55,700 --> 01:10:52,230
were green colored life and I've been

1251
01:10:58,400 --> 01:10:55,710
stuck on this as to why summer life and

1252
01:11:02,750 --> 01:10:58,410
summer actual you know what appear to be

1253
01:11:04,460 --> 01:11:02,760
solid objects UFOs I'm wondering if your

1254
01:11:06,350 --> 01:11:04,470
your school of thought on this we all

1255
01:11:11,150 --> 01:11:06,360
have the capability of like being under

1256
01:11:13,100 --> 01:11:11,160
that light or other like UFOs and the

1257
01:11:15,620 --> 01:11:13,110
solid-looking anyway they just totally

1258
01:11:18,050 --> 01:11:15,630
different well that's a really good

1259
01:11:19,550 --> 01:11:18,060
question of course since the government

1260
01:11:24,080 --> 01:11:19,560
is still denying anything is really

1261
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:24,090
going on and since we they it's like

1262
01:11:28,990 --> 01:11:26,610
Vivian just said when they have some

1263
01:11:32,810 --> 01:11:29,000
physical evidence it all too often

1264
01:11:34,520 --> 01:11:32,820
disappears or gets substituted so we've

1265
01:11:35,570 --> 01:11:34,530
got a real problem there but you've

1266
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:35,580
asked a good question

1267
01:11:40,820 --> 01:11:38,970
and my particular view is is that I

1268
01:11:43,100 --> 01:11:40,830
think there's a series of things a

1269
01:11:45,410 --> 01:11:43,110
variety of things that cause this first

1270
01:11:47,810 --> 01:11:45,420
off I've seen some strange lights

1271
01:11:50,780 --> 01:11:47,820
moving in the night sky usually way high

1272
01:11:52,400 --> 01:11:50,790
up there that would you know my first

1273
01:11:54,800 --> 01:11:52,410
impression would be that I was seeing a

1274
01:11:57,560 --> 01:11:54,810
satellite go over except all of a sudden

1275
01:12:00,709 --> 01:11:57,570
little star it'll change course and I go

1276
01:12:03,200 --> 01:12:00,719
Antoinette that's not a satellite so and

1277
01:12:05,750 --> 01:12:03,210
then I think that we have a situation of

1278
01:12:07,610 --> 01:12:05,760
where like in the Phoenix lights where

1279
01:12:09,470 --> 01:12:07,620
you have an object and there was a solid

1280
01:12:11,750 --> 01:12:09,480
object in the air but it was dark and it

1281
01:12:14,000 --> 01:12:11,760
was dark and he got very bright lights

1282
01:12:15,560 --> 01:12:14,010
on the underside of it so even if it

1283
01:12:17,030 --> 01:12:15,570
comes right over the top of you

1284
01:12:20,180 --> 01:12:17,040
basically all you see are the lights

1285
01:12:23,209 --> 01:12:20,190
okay and then I think we also have the

1286
01:12:27,020 --> 01:12:23,219
possibility that it seems quite evident

1287
01:12:32,240 --> 01:12:27,030
to me that these a lot of these UFO oohs

1288
01:12:34,669 --> 01:12:32,250
are utilizing energy fields and

1289
01:12:40,250 --> 01:12:34,679
oftentimes these energy fields will give

1290
01:12:42,590 --> 01:12:40,260
off a light of various colors and I also

1291
01:12:44,720 --> 01:12:42,600
agree with those who say that I don't

1292
01:12:49,250 --> 01:12:44,730
think we're dealing with one brand of

1293
01:12:53,600 --> 01:12:49,260
UFO here or one particular species you

1294
01:12:55,880 --> 01:12:53,610
know back in the 40s and 50s the big

1295
01:12:58,700 --> 01:12:55,890
question was do they come from Mars or

1296
01:13:00,229 --> 01:12:58,710
do they come from Venus and then as we

1297
01:13:02,450 --> 01:13:00,239
got a little bit more knowledgeable and

1298
01:13:04,729 --> 01:13:02,460
sophisticated in the sixties and

1299
01:13:07,040 --> 01:13:04,739
seventies eighties the question well as

1300
01:13:09,709 --> 01:13:07,050
well did it come from Alpha Centauri or

1301
01:13:12,590 --> 01:13:09,719
do they come from Zeta reticulan for and

1302
01:13:14,780 --> 01:13:12,600
now today we've more knowledgeable and

1303
01:13:16,520 --> 01:13:14,790
more sophisticated than we're asking do

1304
01:13:18,350 --> 01:13:16,530
they come from another dimension do they

1305
01:13:21,709 --> 01:13:18,360
come from another time and Donnie

1306
01:13:25,010 --> 01:13:21,719
frankly I think the answer is yes all of

1307
01:13:27,530 --> 01:13:25,020
the above well here's one this one

1308
01:13:30,320 --> 01:13:27,540
puzzles me too when we see the solid

1309
01:13:32,000 --> 01:13:30,330
object UFOs why do they have marker

1310
01:13:33,470 --> 01:13:32,010
lights on them like standard aircraft do

1311
01:13:35,240 --> 01:13:33,480
so people will talk about oh well I've

1312
01:13:37,010 --> 01:13:35,250
had a colored a red light on this end

1313
01:13:39,070 --> 01:13:37,020
and a white light over here and they

1314
01:13:41,570 --> 01:13:39,080
were flanking those remind me of

1315
01:13:42,919 --> 01:13:41,580
aircraft marker lights they don't want

1316
01:13:45,770 --> 01:13:42,929
to be hit so they got these lights on

1317
01:13:47,990 --> 01:13:45,780
them that are those why would an alien

1318
01:13:51,380 --> 01:13:48,000
technology spacecraft from another world

1319
01:13:54,650 --> 01:13:51,390
how beacon markers on it well maybe they

1320
01:13:56,120 --> 01:13:54,660
don't want to get here neither it seems

1321
01:13:58,760 --> 01:13:56,130
to me like they would want to play a low

1322
01:14:00,680 --> 01:13:58,770
yeah yeah right but Jim

1323
01:14:02,390 --> 01:14:00,690
yeah but when you know that when you

1324
01:14:03,770 --> 01:14:02,400
know there's all kinds of human craft

1325
01:14:06,410 --> 01:14:03,780
flying in the skies

1326
01:14:08,300 --> 01:14:06,420
you don't be up there flying dark you

1327
01:14:12,110 --> 01:14:08,310
level it somebody's liable to hit you

1328
01:14:15,020 --> 01:14:12,120
but now I'm being slightly facetious but

1329
01:14:17,020 --> 01:14:15,030
we don't know maybe that's maybe it's an

1330
01:14:21,050 --> 01:14:17,030
artifact of their propulsion system

1331
01:14:25,490 --> 01:14:21,060
maybe that's their identity markings I

1332
01:14:28,640 --> 01:14:25,500
mean we just don't know and frankly I'll

1333
01:14:31,100 --> 01:14:28,650
also say this I think that a fairly good

1334
01:14:34,970 --> 01:14:31,110
Lee number of especially in recent years

1335
01:14:37,729 --> 01:14:34,980
of UFO sightings may very well be secret

1336
01:14:42,410 --> 01:14:37,739
government test craft so you know they

1337
01:14:44,410 --> 01:14:42,420
make go ahead Mars are like like that I

1338
01:14:47,090 --> 01:14:44,420
automatically I turn away from

1339
01:14:49,160 --> 01:14:47,100
unidentified flying objects and man-made

1340
01:14:51,229 --> 01:14:49,170
flying objects kind of thing it's you

1341
01:14:53,090 --> 01:14:51,239
know because I can understand man

1342
01:14:54,550 --> 01:14:53,100
putting lights on them because maybe

1343
01:14:56,479 --> 01:14:54,560
they don't have the capability of

1344
01:14:57,650 --> 01:14:56,489
maneuvering quite as quick as some of

1345
01:14:59,270 --> 01:14:57,660
these things but you said you've seen

1346
01:15:00,830 --> 01:14:59,280
and other people have seen where you

1347
01:15:01,940 --> 01:15:00,840
think you're seeing a satellite often

1348
01:15:05,750 --> 01:15:01,950
that does it crazy in your neighbors

1349
01:15:07,250 --> 01:15:05,760
right right well I may be not capable of

1350
01:15:09,979 --> 01:15:07,260
doing such a maneuver such as an

1351
01:15:11,800 --> 01:15:09,989
earthbound ship man-made I just put

1352
01:15:15,200 --> 01:15:11,810
clearance like honor I'm not saying they

1353
01:15:17,780 --> 01:15:15,210
understand where my mind was right no

1354
01:15:20,390 --> 01:15:17,790
I'm seeing that and you know you know if

1355
01:15:23,120 --> 01:15:20,400
even if we do say let's say we built a

1356
01:15:25,130 --> 01:15:23,130
craft that is totally anti-gravity

1357
01:15:27,920 --> 01:15:25,140
propulsion you're still going to be

1358
01:15:31,400 --> 01:15:27,930
stuck with you know Air Force regulation

1359
01:15:32,750 --> 01:15:31,410
military regulations FAA regulations and

1360
01:15:34,820 --> 01:15:32,760
maybe if they're flying over an

1361
01:15:36,500 --> 01:15:34,830
inhabited area they have to put on some

1362
01:15:38,180 --> 01:15:36,510
sort of market lights I don't really

1363
01:15:40,370 --> 01:15:38,190
know but I I think you've got a good

1364
01:15:44,690 --> 01:15:40,380
question they're also saying my biggest

1365
01:15:47,590 --> 01:15:44,700
decoration for all we know you know been

1366
01:15:49,880 --> 01:15:47,600
on the ground fly to visit the earth

1367
01:15:51,650 --> 01:15:49,890
maybe they see it as a way of actually

1368
01:15:52,850 --> 01:15:51,660
trying to communicate with us oh that's

1369
01:15:57,680 --> 01:15:52,860
the way they do it so let's do it that

1370
01:15:59,660 --> 01:15:57,690
way yeah and maybe so maybe so and they

1371
01:16:01,220 --> 01:15:59,670
probably go nuts going over the Super

1372
01:16:02,870 --> 01:16:01,230
Bowl you know this is what are they

1373
01:16:05,900 --> 01:16:02,880
saying what are they saying I can't make

1374
01:16:08,090 --> 01:16:05,910
it out but they're sure signaling all

1375
01:16:12,140 --> 01:16:08,100
those lines you're signaling is Donnie

1376
01:16:14,630 --> 01:16:12,150
thank you for the call okay

1377
01:16:17,150 --> 01:16:14,640
I see we have a chase on hold always

1378
01:16:21,500 --> 01:16:17,160
glad talk to chase J see you there

1379
01:16:26,390 --> 01:16:21,510
I am how are you oh if I was any better

1380
01:16:29,360 --> 01:16:26,400
I'd just be delirious great show by the

1381
01:16:34,820 --> 01:16:29,370
way we just love you Jim it's like when

1382
01:16:38,810 --> 01:16:34,830
you go on all eras of gay dude well tell

1383
01:16:41,420 --> 01:16:38,820
you what I tried not to babble I may not

1384
01:16:42,980 --> 01:16:41,430
make it work too well all the time but I

1385
01:16:45,290 --> 01:16:42,990
think we did get some very good

1386
01:16:47,510 --> 01:16:45,300
information out tonight and I think it

1387
01:16:51,290 --> 01:16:47,520
was really extraordinary that we

1388
01:16:53,510 --> 01:16:51,300
actually had two living witnesses who

1389
01:16:56,270 --> 01:16:53,520
are actually there and saw the objects

1390
01:16:59,570 --> 01:16:56,280
that passed over Washington DC in 1952

1391
01:17:02,420 --> 01:16:59,580
and as the listeners heard neither one

1392
01:17:04,900 --> 01:17:02,430
of these eyewitnesses believes the

1393
01:17:08,590 --> 01:17:04,910
official story that it was probably

1394
01:17:10,970 --> 01:17:08,600
temperature inversions and of course I

1395
01:17:13,910 --> 01:17:10,980
scoffed at that the minute I heard it

1396
01:17:16,790 --> 01:17:13,920
because yes there are such a thing as

1397
01:17:19,670 --> 01:17:16,800
temperature versions and they can cause

1398
01:17:21,200 --> 01:17:19,680
reflections of lights up in the sky but

1399
01:17:23,360 --> 01:17:21,210
you're not going to see a move from one

1400
01:17:26,090 --> 01:17:23,370
horizon to the other you know they're

1401
01:17:29,690 --> 01:17:26,100
gonna be above the lights right exactly

1402
01:17:31,610 --> 01:17:29,700
exactly what are your thoughts there you

1403
01:17:33,920 --> 01:17:31,620
know the public is getting a little

1404
01:17:36,710 --> 01:17:33,930
smarter on how some of this works and

1405
01:17:38,240 --> 01:17:36,720
you know it's like when I was down

1406
01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:38,250
hunting the honey island swamp monster

1407
01:17:43,040 --> 01:17:41,010
and we presented them on the show and

1408
01:17:45,620 --> 01:17:43,050
you know somebody said oh well they're

1409
01:17:47,390 --> 01:17:45,630
probably seeing swamp gas you know and I

1410
01:17:51,350 --> 01:17:47,400
just laughed at the comment because it's

1411
01:17:54,830 --> 01:17:51,360
like these people have what their 3rd

1412
01:17:56,690 --> 01:17:54,840
4th 5th generation born raised lives

1413
01:18:00,290 --> 01:17:56,700
they make their living on that swamp I

1414
01:18:01,820 --> 01:18:00,300
bet they know that I think you're

1415
01:18:04,120 --> 01:18:01,830
absolutely right and we're about to run

1416
01:18:06,980 --> 01:18:04,130
out of time but mentioning swamp gas I

1417
01:18:08,870 --> 01:18:06,990
think this is swamp gas is what got

1418
01:18:12,860 --> 01:18:08,880
Gerald Ford made President of the United

1419
01:18:15,500 --> 01:18:12,870
States you ready for this hit it

1420
01:18:18,170 --> 01:18:15,510
way back there he is a representative

1421
01:18:20,840 --> 01:18:18,180
from Michigan they had a very

1422
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:20,850
sensational UFO sighting up there around

1423
01:18:29,710 --> 01:18:24,050
a girls college as I recall

1424
01:18:33,370 --> 01:18:29,720
they sent their scientific people up

1425
01:18:36,550 --> 01:18:33,380
there and they held a press conference

1426
01:18:40,360 --> 01:18:36,560
they said we think it was swamp gas and

1427
01:18:42,670 --> 01:18:40,370
that so enraged the people the good

1428
01:18:44,080 --> 01:18:42,680
people in Michigan that they just

1429
01:18:46,240 --> 01:18:44,090
pressured Gerald Ford their

1430
01:18:48,760 --> 01:18:46,250
representative and he announced that he

1431
01:18:49,990 --> 01:18:48,770
was going to call form a committee in

1432
01:18:53,500 --> 01:18:50,000
Congress and they were going to

1433
01:18:56,140 --> 01:18:53,510
seriously investigate UFOs because you

1434
01:18:58,330 --> 01:18:56,150
know something's going on and and it

1435
01:19:03,220 --> 01:18:58,340
wasn't a swamp gas

1436
01:19:05,500 --> 01:19:03,230
even if J Allen Hynek said so so but

1437
01:19:08,650 --> 01:19:05,510
then somebody obviously got to him and

1438
01:19:11,860 --> 01:19:08,660
before that committee could be convened

1439
01:19:15,250 --> 01:19:11,870
he kind of dropped all of the calls for

1440
01:19:17,500 --> 01:19:15,260
a UFO committee and kind of went soft on

1441
01:19:19,840 --> 01:19:17,510
the whole issue and then of course when

1442
01:19:21,640 --> 01:19:19,850
Richard Nixon began to get into trouble

1443
01:19:23,380 --> 01:19:21,650
I'm sure they told him Jerry you know

1444
01:19:26,920 --> 01:19:23,390
hang in there we'll take care of you and

1445
01:19:29,860 --> 01:19:26,930
when Nixon got in trouble they appointed

1446
01:19:32,500 --> 01:19:29,870
he appointed Gerald Ford as as his vice

1447
01:19:34,930 --> 01:19:32,510
president after Spiro Agnew was run out

1448
01:19:37,000 --> 01:19:34,940
of office and of course then when Nixon

1449
01:19:39,040 --> 01:19:37,010
was run out of office Gerald Ford became

1450
01:19:40,930 --> 01:19:39,050
president of the United States maybe

1451
01:19:45,190 --> 01:19:40,940
that's what you can expect if you keep

1452
01:19:48,420 --> 01:19:45,200
quiet about UFOs in that interesting hey

1453
01:19:53,950 --> 01:19:48,430
hey Gideon's not on the phone oh I see

1454
01:19:55,510 --> 01:19:53,960
yes oh we've only got about two minutes

1455
01:19:58,570 --> 01:19:55,520
to go let's go oh

1456
01:20:00,970 --> 01:19:58,580
jumpin Jim hold on hold on tight okay

1457
01:20:03,550 --> 01:20:00,980
baby and when you were describing

1458
01:20:06,370 --> 01:20:03,560
looking up at the kid at the discs and

1459
01:20:08,290 --> 01:20:06,380
everything you remember how many there

1460
01:20:10,950 --> 01:20:08,300
were up there I think they were about

1461
01:20:17,110 --> 01:20:14,770
awesome seven and have you heard any

1462
01:20:19,540 --> 01:20:17,120
accounts from any other of the witnesses

1463
01:20:21,400 --> 01:20:19,550
maybe kids that you played with or you

1464
01:20:23,020 --> 01:20:21,410
know did you guys talk about it at all I

1465
01:20:25,600 --> 01:20:23,030
kind of know the answer already being a

1466
01:20:27,790 --> 01:20:25,610
military no nobody did because you know

1467
01:20:29,880 --> 01:20:27,800
and I didn't especially because I

1468
01:20:32,790 --> 01:20:29,890
thought it was top secret you know

1469
01:20:36,370 --> 01:20:32,800
because of the way my dad acted and then

1470
01:20:36,899 --> 01:20:36,380
the the people next door he was army and

1471
01:20:41,640 --> 01:20:36,909
he was a

1472
01:20:43,080 --> 01:20:41,650
best friends with his kids but none of

1473
01:20:45,090 --> 01:20:43,090
us ever talked about it because we just

1474
01:20:46,890 --> 01:20:45,100
assumed it was top secret I mean you

1475
01:20:49,260 --> 01:20:46,900
grew up in the military and you you're

1476
01:20:52,020 --> 01:20:49,270
taught you know you there's you just

1477
01:20:54,990 --> 01:20:52,030
don't talk about certain things and you

1478
01:20:57,810 --> 01:20:55,000
don't ask absolutely and it's something

1479
01:20:59,340 --> 01:20:57,820
that you're told all the time but if

1480
01:21:03,120 --> 01:20:59,350
there's a certain behavior no matter

1481
01:21:04,620 --> 01:21:03,130
what you see in this lifestyle you don't

1482
01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:04,630
even think about talking about it it's

1483
01:21:09,959 --> 01:21:07,530
just it's a way of life it's how you

1484
01:21:11,640 --> 01:21:09,969
play and understand that but when you

1485
01:21:14,220 --> 01:21:11,650
told your story earlier I was very

1486
01:21:16,919 --> 01:21:14,230
excited to hear about when you said you

1487
01:21:19,919 --> 01:21:16,929
looked up how many objects now is that

1488
01:21:23,160 --> 01:21:19,929
what was reported as well like it that

1489
01:21:25,770 --> 01:21:23,170
baby I don't know okay well hey let me

1490
01:21:29,669 --> 01:21:25,780
throw in here I think the answer that is

1491
01:21:32,399 --> 01:21:29,679
is that and this is explanatory some of

1492
01:21:34,680 --> 01:21:32,409
the counts I read I said nine objects

1493
01:21:36,629 --> 01:21:34,690
and others say eight but then if you

1494
01:21:40,110 --> 01:21:36,639
listen to Paul he said one of them

1495
01:21:44,970 --> 01:21:40,120
separated and then now we've got Vivian

1496
01:21:46,680 --> 01:21:44,980
who said there was about eight no yeah I

1497
01:21:48,629 --> 01:21:46,690
thought they were around seven you know

1498
01:21:50,879 --> 01:21:48,639
I mean I can't I can't be positive

1499
01:21:52,680 --> 01:21:50,889
because it was so long ago but in my

1500
01:21:55,470 --> 01:21:52,690
mind's eye and I think it was about

1501
01:21:57,660 --> 01:21:55,480
seven and I remember seeing two of them

1502
01:22:01,500 --> 01:21:57,670
kind of separating off from the cluster

1503
01:22:03,360 --> 01:22:01,510
is right one or more than the other what

1504
01:22:05,760 --> 01:22:03,370
I'm suggesting is is that there could

1505
01:22:07,770 --> 01:22:05,770
have been mine to begin with and then

1506
01:22:09,990 --> 01:22:07,780
two of them separated off and there were

1507
01:22:12,120 --> 01:22:10,000
seven and then maybe two more separated

1508
01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:12,130
off anyway they seem to be moving around

1509
01:22:16,260 --> 01:22:15,250
and changing in formation which I think

1510
01:22:18,270 --> 01:22:16,270
we're moving around

1511
01:22:21,060 --> 01:22:18,280
yeah this accounts for the discrepancy

1512
01:22:23,790 --> 01:22:21,070
in some of the witnesses on seven sums

1513
01:22:25,860 --> 01:22:23,800
on eight sums all night I think it's

1514
01:22:28,830 --> 01:22:25,870
perfectly understandable well I think

1515
01:22:31,830 --> 01:22:28,840
we're out of time and so we're going to

1516
01:22:36,709 --> 01:22:31,840
have to call a an abrupt end to this

1517
01:22:40,290 --> 01:22:36,719
really fascinating epic Voyager

1518
01:22:43,560 --> 01:22:40,300
expedition and this is your permanent

1519
01:22:48,209 --> 01:22:43,570
floating part time sometimes occasional

1520
01:22:50,500 --> 01:22:48,219
fill-in host Jamar wishing everyone here

1521
01:22:52,839 --> 01:22:50,510
a really great evening

1522
01:22:54,790 --> 01:22:52,849
and uh better tomorrow and thank you for

1523
01:22:57,640 --> 01:22:54,800
tuning in and we'll be doing this again

1524
01:23:00,669 --> 01:22:57,650
real soon and Thank You Vivian Thank You

1525
01:23:02,950 --> 01:23:00,679
chase Thank You Donnie we had some other

1526
01:23:04,899 --> 01:23:02,960
callers on the line I'm I'm sorry

1527
01:23:17,720 --> 01:23:04,909
hang in there may we get to you next

1528
01:23:22,200 --> 01:23:19,770
thank you for being with us tonight

1529
01:23:23,669 --> 01:23:22,210
please join us again next Monday evening

1530
01:23:26,430 --> 01:23:23,679
for extraordinary phenomenon

1531
01:23:29,459 --> 01:23:26,440
investigations Council's epic voyages